Poll

When you make a kill or are killed what should or shouldn't be displayed on the screen (HUD)?

Show who you just killed.
57 (17.9%)
Don't show who you just killed.
15 (4.7%)
Only show who you killed if you killed a friendly (team kill).
30 (9.4%)
Add delay before your kill is confirmed.
18 (5.6%)
Show the person who killed you.
59 (18.5%)
Do not show who killed you.
16 (5%)
Show who just killed you for frienldy fire (team kill) only.
20 (6.3%)
Show which specific weapon (K98, Lee Enfield MK III, ....) you were killed with.
47 (14.7%)
Show general type of weapon (tank, airplane, handheld, ...) you were killed with.
16 (5%)
Don't show weapon that killed you at all.
17 (5.3%)
Show weapon that killed you if you were killed by friendly fire (team kill) only.
13 (4.1%)
Add delay before you are shown who or what killed you
11 (3.4%)

Total Members Voted: 96

Author Topic: Kill messages: Your stance  (Read 6623 times)

Offline Admiral Donutz

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Kill messages: Your stance
« on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:12 »
Before you vote read this  first please:
- You have multiple votes  and you can change your vote if you made a mistake ! -

In the first category you can vote for your favourit setup for kills that you make:
- Show who you just killed.
- Don't show who you just killed.
- Only show who you killed if you killed a friendly (team kill).

- Add delay before your kill is confirmed.

In the second category you can vote for your setup regarding the messages that shows information on who or what just killed you:

- Show the person who killed you.
- Do not show who killed you.
- Show who just killed you for frienldy fire (team kill) only.

- Show which specific weapon (K98, Lee Enfield MK III, ....) you were killed with.
- Show general type of weapon (tank, airplane, handheld, ...) you were killed with.
-  Don't show weapon that killed you at all.
-  Show weapon that killed you if you were killed by friendly fire (team kill) only.

-  Add delay before you are shown who or what killed you

Please read the poll carefully and select a combination of options that would be the most satisfying in your opinion.  I made this "complex" poll so that any combination of "kill" and "killed by" messages should be possible.  You may change your vote if you made a mistake.

For example, if you like the current system you vote:
- Option 1 (Show who you just killed)
- Option 5 (Show the person who killed you)
- Option 8 (Show the specific weapon that killed you).

If you (like me) rather do not show who you just shot (except  TKs) and you wish to be shown who killed you but no with which weapon you were killed:
- Option 3 (Only show if you killed a friendly)
- Option  5 (Show the person who killed you)
- Option 10 (Don't show the weapon that killed you at all.
« Last Edit: 11-04-2009, 18:04:20 by Admiral Donutz »

Offline rattovolante

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #1 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:45 »
I like the current system - I approach FH2 as a game, not a simulation.

Anyway, if possible I would make a change which is not shown in the options:
a server-side option to have names of TKers only shown to admins (if admins are online) to avoid endless TK name-calling. When no admins are online, things as usual, players can do justice themselves :P

so players get "someone [teamkills] rattovolante", but the admins get "eeevil donutz tker [teamkills] rattovolante"

Of course I know this is entirely server-side so any server can implement it on their own (although they might have to renounce the [PURE] setting?)
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Offline fh_spitfire

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #2 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:00 »
Before I make up my mind and vote in this poll, I have one suggestion related to this: if we had no killmessages it'd be good to make the dead bodies stay a bit longer, so something like hunting the area that you fired at 2 minutes ago searching for dead body or supporting MG gunner with binoculars would have much more sense.

Offline Schneider

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #3 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:17 »
As I said in the other thread, I think it would be better if we had no kill messages (except maybe the type of weapon, and in case of teamkills, definitely). If people know who killed them, they will appropiately go and search for the Heckenschütze e.g., once they've killed them, they compare the person killed to the one that has killed them all the time.
Now if this wasn't the case, and they shot someone else, they might think they have catched the right one - and you, as the real sharpshooter, could go on if your timing is good.
This is just one of many examples one could give for something like that. Surplus it would eliminate stupid little feuds people start when having been killed by a special person etc., which draws them away from teamplay to IM GONNA KILL THAT SON OF A (female dog).

SO DO IT DO IT, DO IT!!!!!11einseinself

EDIT: Spits idea doesn't sound too bad. I think leaving them laying around for a minute later wouldn't mean significantly more lag (for bodies only, not with tanks etc.)?

Offline Eat Uranium

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #4 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:16 »
I support the removal of most of the messages.  I think that they not only make some of the long range shooting easier by giving you the cue to come out of cover afterwards, but the constant scrolling of the text is quite distracting.

When you kill, you should only know it if you teamkilled.  Your score should only be updated once the person you killed respawns.

When killed, you should have no idea who killed you unless it was a team kill.  Once you respawn, you should be told what generic item caused your demise.

The only thing that isn't on the list is that you should see deaths from your own team - but not the killers or equipment.  Say that teamate "N00bk1lla" kets killed by a panzer 2; you would see in the upper corner "N00bk1lla was killed by the enemy".

Disregard the above, my opinion has changed!
See post 32 for my new opinion.
« Last Edit: 11-04-2009, 21:04:08 by Eat Uranium »

Offline Flippy Warbear

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #5 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:43 »
Donutz' personal opinion (combination 3, 5, 10) suits myself the best aswell.

Offline Thorondor123

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #6 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:22 »
Donutz' personal opinion (combination 3, 5, 10) suits myself the best aswell.
I'll have the same as this gentleman.
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Offline Admiral Donutz

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #7 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:02 »
The only thing that isn't on the list is that you should see deaths from your own team - but not the killers or equipment.  Say that teamate "N00bk1lla" kets killed by a panzer 2; you would see in the upper corner "N00bk1lla was killed by the enemy".
I'd consider this part of the feedback when you are killed. If you are killed and text is shown it is shown to you and simular text is shown to the team.  Or  I'd have to reset the poll and extend it even further making it way too messy (perhaps I should look for multiple polls in a row?). 

I'd wish I could have made a few polls in a row so it is a bit more easy to understand the various combinations available.



Why did I vote the way I did? :
- Option 3 (Only show if you killed a friendly)
- Option  5 (Show the person who killed you)
- Option 10 (Don't show the weapon that killed you at all.

Because when you kill:
-  I think that giving away who killed you spoils a lot of information, it removes the "Did I ot him or did I not?" factor completely.  That ain't fun. It's much more fun to find out you wasted time waiting for an enemy that is long gone or long dead or that manages to kill you 'cause you thought you cleared the area...
- Not showing any kills you make is not good, people could end up making TK after TK without realizing, especially if they are new to the game.
- Thus it would be important to tell people when they make a TK but otherwise don't inform them of kills.
- Sure, people could check the scoreboard to see if they got a higher score but this would require some time, take your eye of the battlefield (good for the enemy if you did not kill him) and thus would generally reduce the times people use this "game exploit of information" to find out if they made a kill. Especially in a tense situation you don't go and check your score.
- It would be nice if your score would be update when the people you killed respawn, probably not possible though and might cause problems at the end of the round.

Because when you are killed:
- It's nice to know who killed you, just for the element of fun ("haha, damn it jumjum killed be again, bugger!").
- It makes it easier to report a name when somebody kills you in an unfair manner ("What the? That's an exploit the guy just used!! Damn you Flippy you cheat! *reports to admin*).
- Showing which exact weapon killed you gives away too much info, you will know that a sniper got you and thus look for him. But how the hell would you know a sniper got you unles you saw the guy with your own eyes?! This causes people hunting for snipers and other hidden enemies which is "unfair".
- SHowing the general type of weapon could be an option, though even this may sometimes give you too much info unless you actually saw it with your own eyes what killed you.  Atleast you won't know a sniper rifle got you but just a "handweapon"  which could be anything basically.
- Not showing the weapon that killed you at all prevents you knowing too much completely. Unless you saw it with your own eyes you won't know what got you. SO if you are killed from behind you won't be able to yell over team chat "Watchout, a tank just shot me from behind!" , it could have been a grenade, mortar or arty impact or even infantry...  thus keeping up the element of suprise and keeping you guessing. You might think a tank got you, take "approperiate"  measures on respawn only to find out you were wrong (or you will never find out at all... hah!).

Conclusion:
With this setup people know when they make a TK, are TK-ed and have to guess which weapon got them unless they saw it with there own eys. They will know who got them for fun (it's a game afterall) and fairness (reporting cheaters).  An acceptable alternative would be to show the general type of weapon that killed you.
« Last Edit: 11-04-2009, 19:04:57 by Admiral Donutz »

Offline Hockeywarrior

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #8 on: 11-04-2009, 18:04:14 »
I think the current death messages system is fine, but I think showing what weapon or vehicle killed you is a bit too much. I like knowing who killed me in FH2, because often times I actually KNOW that person. Sometimes its fun to wage a private war with another person on the other team across the period of a game... but that's just me.

If this were meant to be an infantry simulator, I would say nix all death messages PERIOD, but it's FH... come on.

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Offline bosco

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #9 on: 11-04-2009, 19:04:10 »
Show nothing except Teamkills.

(obvious huh  :P )

Offline Kubador

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #10 on: 11-04-2009, 19:04:16 »
This one is a slapper. Tough nut to crack I may add even. I'll try to make it short: In the way FH2 stands now, kill messages should stay as they are now.

No kill message just doesn't suit FH's gameplay as we now know (I know it doesn't tell you much, sorry). If I'd have to make comparison it would be like to make bunnyhopping enabled in PR just to make it more 'casual' than simulator. In the end the rest of the game doesn't stand up to the way one of it's aspects is presented. IMHO having one part be very realistic/simulator-like while other parts are too much arcadey in contrast, just spoils the game as a whole.

For another comparison: it's like listening to a classical concert and suddenly the piano player starts to improvise in blues/jazz style. Sure, he plays great but it doesn't change the fact it ruined the whole concert.

Also, I concur with hockeywarrior here. Removing kill-msgs just makes the game too much anonymous. I like to play with people I know on the server and those messages give me a bit information about that person. Is he infantry type, does he play well, is he a templayer or a deuche. Personal war gives me pleasure as well. It's simply fun in the way I see it to be killed (f.e.) Sdt-D and then I can return the favour after a while. In our small community making people even more anonymous just weakens it. I'm really glad that devs didn't have the guts to change that aspect of FH.

There are also few gameplay problems with the dissapearence of kill-msgs but I'll not mention them... now. :)

I'm a fan of making things more realistic and a bit of PRish in FH but then again it wouldn't be FH as we know it, right?

Offline Fuchs

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #11 on: 11-04-2009, 19:04:19 »
1, 5, 8. I like how it is now. And if you completely remove it theres no way to impress others with knifing someone or bicycling someone. No way to screenshot it. The horror.
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Offline NoCoolOnesLeft

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #12 on: 11-04-2009, 19:04:31 »
Fine as is. Is FH2 going all PR?
« Last Edit: 11-04-2009, 19:04:38 by NoCoolOnesLeft »

Offline Kildar

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #13 on: 11-04-2009, 19:04:04 »
Fine as is, besides whats the point to killing infantry with the bayonet, the knife, Bare fists, the recon plane, the UVC, static objects, the ATR, the smoke grenade, etc etc. If you don't get confirmation of the kill, the guy you killed doesn't get confirmation of the kill, and the server doesn't get confirmation.

Offline Schneider

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Re: Kill messages: Your stance
« Reply #14 on: 11-04-2009, 19:04:42 »
What the fuck is it that people have with PR all the time?
This is a suggestion that stands for its own, not a "I saw this in PR and I thought"-suggestion.
And the server always gets confirmation. Me at least, I play for myself, not to show others on the server "Look, I killed one with the bayonett!"  ;)