Author Topic: Berlin  (Read 8778 times)

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #165 on: 19-08-2018, 21:08:38 »
Oh wow, I didn't see the minimap before :). Just some more comments;

There are some parts that seem very narrow for 100 players (like the approaches to Ruins/ Yard & Boulevard). They might not be, but just keep in mind that you don't want to create too many hardcore bottlenecks. The result is something like Brest where American's can't push past the mob of defenders and it ends up as Op Metro. I count 3 main streets to the Yard/ Ruins sector but as long as the blocks in between have many places to cross between each road/ even push the flags it should be ok. :)

As long as there's multiple routes to attack a flag so player density isn't too high.

I'm not sure how the sectors work (I'm counting 5 or 6?) but it looks like they have nice progression and each sector is distinct and separate on the minimap. I wouldn't add any more sectors as this seems like enough.

Curious to see how it plays! :D

Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #166 on: 21-08-2018, 12:08:02 »
I would have liked to create a more ruined city but there's a lack of destroyed statics. I placed as many as I could without being too repetitive.

The lightmap will be created when I finish adding small objects. I saved the lightmap settings I liked after days of testing, it is not nearly as dark and grim as the FH1 version, that one seemed really exagerated imo.

I checked the FHSW map and it was made in 1:1 scale apparently. That would make it impossible to combine the city's outskirts and the Reichstag obviously. Even if I managed to impot the Reichstag in the future I would save it for a 1:1 scaled map like FHSW, even though the surrounding statics would not look appropiate and if I am not mistaken the Reichstag model is closed, it has no interior to fight for.

Any changes are welcome though, even if they are major, as long as they enrich the map since I guess no one else will ever make another Berlin map for this mod (I hope I'm wrong).

About the layout:

1. Ruins / Yard

It was briefely tested with about 12 players, I like how it did. That is all the map testing I got and will ever get, at least from CMP. The 3 streets are connected. I added a fourth one and then I removed it. Russians start off with 4 tanks, that should be enough to break through eventually. Germans only have a pair of static AT guns.

2. Hospital / Supply Dump

Approaches are very open. Germans have 3 static guns and 2  tanks. Russians get 7 tanks.

3. Boulevard

Recently added to link up with the next sector. It should mainly serve as a spawn point for the russians. It's very open and easy to take with superior tank numbers.

4. Square / Altona

Wide, long and open streets. Little cover, long range engagements. Tank dominance. 4 german tanks along with 2 immobilized used as pillboxes. Russians get 9 tanks. I expect this sector to be the defining one, it's hard to capture.

5. Last flags

Short range engagements. Even though bloody, I expect the russians to end it quickly because they are close to eachother and close to Altona. In short, a very action packed ending, no more than 5 mins.
« Last Edit: 21-08-2018, 12:08:03 by blander »

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #167 on: 21-08-2018, 18:08:32 »
Well I'm glad someone's attempting one. :) I know there's not a lot of statics to choose from, but that could always be changed by some eager modelers or texture work. All that's important right now is that it plays well imo, the aesthetic stuff could come later.

All those tanks seem like a lot for urban combat, since there's only a few routes for them to move. Hopefully it won't create too much explosive spam. That seems to be the biggest issue with urban maps.

It's nice that you got to test it with CMP, that's huge. it would be nice to test it on a pub server with proper player amounts. Maybe when the updated version of the CMP is complete, we could hold a few days of testing on it.

What do you plan on doing with the map in the future?

Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #168 on: 22-08-2018, 01:08:02 »
There are a lot of tanks, yes. The soviets fielded lots of armor for this battle so I think it's fine. For example I hate to play Tobruk as allies because of the constant deaths to enemy artillery. But hey, if the real battle was like that then I respect it.

I carefully placed open buildings and cover for the german AT infantry to hide in. Besides, there are plenty AT guns, it's not like every soviet tank will be alive all the time through the whole map.

Right now I'd say 90% of the map is complete. Little things are missing like cables, ambient sounds, french sign textures need to be replaced, lightmap, combat area, etc.

My goal is to have the map incorporated into the CMP pool. Tournament usage has been taken out of the question because it's a straight forward push map.


Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #169 on: 03-09-2018, 07:09:31 »











Offline |7th|Nighthawk

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #170 on: 03-09-2018, 08:09:47 »
Looks quite good to me but I have a few observations to make: The rooms look a little empty at times and seem too orderly (There are a lot of 90° and 45° angles here) and I would assume that some of the places were left in a hurry - like that bar/restaurant e.g. or even if not, you would rarely see such perfection. That makeshift hospital nails that better in my opinion but you could maybe spice it up even more with the beds. I take it that you're conservative with the objects to keep the performance high?
Anyway, it's cool to see the WIPs :)
"I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that..."

Offline nysä

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #171 on: 03-09-2018, 08:09:49 »
Looks promising! Another suggestion, the walls could use some random morale scribbles like "Berlin bleibt deutsch", as seen in the Seelow Heights. And perhaps some bicycles?



Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #172 on: 03-09-2018, 08:09:08 »
I´m worried about performance. I don´t know the details about CPU usage limit and stuff like that. In general I try to copy the object saturation from other maps. I´d like to add a ton of details (and I had) but I chose to remove hundreds of objects to have 6000 max in total.

I am kind of measuring the performance with the FPS since my computer is old and it goes up and down considerably depending on the static objects´ saturation. FPS drop at the hospital area so I´m only adding what is 100% necessary.

What parameter should I take into consideration to know if the amount of statics I´m placing is within acceptable limits?

I´ll stuff up those rooms a bit more and give them a more chaotic feel.

I added a lot more smoke columns everywhere. Do they consume too much memory? Should I be careful with that or is it acceptable to have lots of smoke around all the map?

Quote
Looks promising! Another suggestion, the walls could use some random morale scribbles like "Berlin bleibt deutsch", as seen in the Seelow Heights. And perhaps some bicycles?

I used 2 or 3 from Seelow already and I plan on having at least 1 new one. I might ask for suggestions here when I get to that phase. I also gathered lots of signs from different maps to have them re-textured to "Friseur", "Lebensmittel-Geschäft", "Brauerei", "Apotheke", "Hotel-Pension" etc. The bar will have a Fanta ad.

Offline nysä

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #173 on: 03-09-2018, 09:09:26 »
I used 2 or 3 from Seelow already and I plan on having at least 1 new one. I might ask for suggestions here when I get to that phase. I also gathered lots of signs from different maps to have them re-textured to "Friseur", "Lebensmittel-Geschäft", "Brauerei", "Apotheke", "Hotel-Pension" etc. The bar will have a Fanta ad.

Great. "Lieber tot als Sklave" was also another endkampf slogan, also found on Berlin Zoo Bunker

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #174 on: 03-09-2018, 16:09:35 »
I´m worried about performance. I don´t know the details about CPU usage limit and stuff like that. In general I try to copy the object saturation from other maps. I´d like to add a ton of details (and I had) but I chose to remove hundreds of objects to have 6000 max in total.

I am kind of measuring the performance with the FPS since my computer is old and it goes up and down considerably depending on the static objects´ saturation. FPS drop at the hospital area so I´m only adding what is 100% necessary.

Measuring your own FPS is good. Also, I think you can alt tab with the map open and open task manager to see how much ram it uses. Around 2GB is the upper limit. (I think)

Quote
What parameter should I take into consideration to know if the amount of statics I´m placing is within acceptable limits?

Personally I’d crack open Seelow and try to keep static count around the same as that map.

Quote
I added a lot more smoke columns everywhere. Do they consume too much memory? Should I be careful with that or is it acceptable to have lots of smoke around all the map?

AFAIK smoke can cause FPS drops more than most things.

Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #175 on: 02-10-2018, 05:10:09 »
The map is crashing at 14%.

I checked and double-checked the map crash percentages thread but I failed to find a solution.

I tried deleting gameplayobjects.con and staticobjects.con, among other things, but that didn´t fix it. In one of the ocations I had a memory error message, I don´t remember what it said exactly.

I really don´t know what else to try. I took a break from working on this map 15 days ago so now I don´t remember exactly what was the last thing I did to the map that could be causing this problem. I added a few more static objects, that´s for sure, but I think that wouldn´t be the reason of this crash.
« Last Edit: 02-10-2018, 09:10:39 by blander »

Offline Stubbfan

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #176 on: 02-10-2018, 12:10:47 »
Probably overgrowth.

Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #177 on: 02-10-2018, 20:10:45 »
It has no overgrowth, only static trees and undergrowth. How can I discard possibilities?

Offline blander

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #178 on: 04-10-2018, 08:10:26 »
Fixed. The secondary terrain was corrupted.

Offline FiveStars

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Re: Berlin
« Reply #179 on: 25-10-2018, 15:10:40 »
Wonderful project! I don't really know the capabilities of your mapping, but if it turns out well enough, it could be in FH 2.55 or 2.6  ;D. A few pointers anyway: The FHSW Reichstag's is open AFAIK, and it would make a very good separate map, maybe even the fhurer bunker there could be incorporated. I would guess, although I may be wrong, there may be some devs who could lease a helping hand  ;)