Author Topic: AP-mine Gameplay  (Read 1849 times)

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #15 on: 17-04-2016, 21:04:56 »
Having played a bit with mines recently I'd say the nerfhammer hit a bit too hard this time. At least the rearm time should be lowered a bit, because frankly they aren't really worth the effort now.

I don't think so at all. It seems perfect to me. Now there's not an S-mine at every doorway but there are plenty of times that I'm kept out of a flag or have slowed the enemy down capping a flag with 1 well placed mine.

Now it just seems like you have to be smarter with where you place the smines. It takes a bit more skill.

Quote
  (teamkills are much more likely)
allowing more smines will not help this issue.

Offline Nerdsturm

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #16 on: 18-04-2016, 00:04:08 »

I have never seen any clipping issues, even when they could still be placed on walls.


They go through anything that doesn't have collision, so namely "undergrowth" which includes a fair amount of the rubble and rocks on the ground. It's not a problem with the American AP mines because they're quite tall, but the S-mines can be almost completely obscured if you put them inside a rock.

Regarding mines on stairs: utilize engineer kits. Isn't that one of the things you people are complaining about? Engineer kits, with their wrench and mine markers, are actually useful. You could also just crawl over mines without triggering them.

This is impossible with a lot of mine placements. People know of the issue where you can't get near mines on stairs and exploit it heavily. It's a big problem on certain flags like the central flag on Bastogne or 16p Mt. Olympus  since they have an ammo box in the flag zone and its possible to completely (or almost completely in Bastogne's case) wall off the flag zone with s-mines by placing them at stairs and ladders.

And it's not unrealistic to make disarming s-mines easier. While yeah, you can't realistically disarm them by shooting them, they also shouldn't be a huge threat if you see them. Even if it is in a place where you can craw under it, realistically you'd just step over it or something. The cost of having to stop and go prone under it is pretty huge if you're trying to assault a flag.

Offline GeoPat

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #17 on: 18-04-2016, 02:04:09 »
When I was a high-ping noob for years I used grenades and smgs as an equalizer.  I was also an AT and AA gun whore.  The AA in Olympus castle was my favorite.  It made a shit noob feel like a warrior king atop his tower.  I've only seen "effective" AP mining in tournament play where you have time to put out a lot of them and then use them as warning system when defending a flag.  In public play it's just a cheap kill.  It sometimes gets the lead attacker or the ninja but that's about it.  It can ruin a defense on some maps as much as it slows an assault.  There's nothing like team mate putting a mine right where you want to go or dig in.

Offline kingtiger1891

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #18 on: 18-04-2016, 02:04:22 »
but the S-mines can be almost completely obscured if you put them inside a rock.

And what's the problem with it? Mines are supposed to be hidden in the first place. Does every mine need to shout out "Hey I'm here"? Or like what they did in bf3/4 to put a giant icon on minimap.


To me smines were a great weapon to defeat some clueless rush kind of players in a halarious way, like this angry kid get blown up 4 times in a row and then cursed me: www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxSteK7smF0, which was great fun. It's the type of weapon old FPS games had but can't be seen in modern games like bf4 or cod, since those are infested with rush-kid gameplay style.

I haven't played with this thing and blown ppl up for a long time since WAW Thursday players went single digit, but it still sickens me how some ppl ask to nerf it again and again just because they don't like it.

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #19 on: 18-04-2016, 03:04:04 »
To me smines were a great weapon to defeat some clueless rush kind of players in a halarious way...

You still can. There's still 1 mine in the kit, it hasn't been removed completely. Now you just need to use a bit more skill and foresight before placing it.

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...it still sickens me how some ppl ask to nerf it again and again just because they don't like it.

This is AP mines first 'nerf' if you wanna call it that. Afaik they haven't been changed since 2.0. I actually suggested lessening the amount of overall mines internally for 2 reasons;

1. The amount of mines were pretty ‘spammy;’ especially small maps with few flag routes. It’s easy to see on some maps like Giarabub when many recon players end up with far more teamkills than actual kills.

2. Mines don't fit the historical accuracy that FH2 strives for. There’s an argument that can be made for why mines exist in this game at all. Mines weren’t commonly used in real life the way that they are in FH2; individuals didn’t carry a few spare AP Mines in their kit just to toss on the ground in the heat of battle. IRL mines were carefully placed, marked and noted by everyone who needed to know, and mainly placed in ‘fields’ beforehand in the sense that they were grouped together as an area denial weapon. Sure there are exceptions, as with everything. There’s more than a few cases of mines being placed as ‘booby-traps’ left behind by a retreating enemy or stealthily placed behind enemy lines to disrupt supply routes. But that wasn’t as common and still doesn’t entirely fit with the way mines are represented in FH2.

Imo, FH2 mines can be thought of as being carried by a platoon, or battalion, (in FH2s case represented by a squad) who use them while defending a flag by placing them at strategic points in their defensive line. They should be placed with care, and they should take time and thought to be used properly.

From a gameplay standpoint, mines are a great way to manipulate gameplay and introduce an overall strategy into how a team defends or attacks a certain area. This is how mines should work in-game, not as a short distance sticky grenade thrown from a balcony like they’re sometimes used :P

So imo lessening the amount of mines allows people to think before placing them and overall makes the game less spammy. Now you have to ask yourself, 'do I wanna place a mine on the stairs to completely deny people from accessing my sniping spot? Or do I wanna put it in a place where it will more than likely kill a whole squad at a bottleneck point to a flag?' Whereas before you could just say 'por que no los dos?'
« Last Edit: 18-04-2016, 03:04:56 by Matthew_Baker »

Offline Ivancic1941

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #20 on: 18-04-2016, 05:04:17 »
I once tryed removing AP mine but my mine detector wasnt reacting.. Can AP mines be removed?
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Offline Flippy Warbear

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #21 on: 18-04-2016, 09:04:45 »
You dont remove mines with the detector, you remove them with the wrench. Detector is only for... detecting! *gasp*

Offline Ivancic1941

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #22 on: 18-04-2016, 15:04:42 »
You dont remove mines with the detector, you remove them with the wrench. Detector is only for... detecting! *gasp*
Yes,Im not stupid. I wanted to say that detector doesnt detect AP mines for me. Tryed few times,but nothing
Floppy Wardisc or Floppy Wierdbear

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #23 on: 18-04-2016, 17:04:17 »
Afaik they only detect AT Mines. And even then you have to be pretty spot on when you sweep over it for it to detect properly. The detectors could actually use an overhaul but then you have to ask "is it worth it?"

Offline Airshark79

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #24 on: 18-04-2016, 18:04:16 »
it's just a gimmick

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #25 on: 18-04-2016, 18:04:18 »
I think the devs wanted mine detectors to have some gameplay value in the early days of FH2. But the way the gameplay evolved they were made kinda useless.

They're still valuable on a map like Omaha beach for the Americans since there's only 1 way to get the tanks off the beach. But even then I don't think the Americans have them in any kits so yea, :P

Offline Airshark79

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #26 on: 18-04-2016, 18:04:12 »
 ::) Guess you could streamline that system with mines being visible as dirt mounds with decoys available to deploy for engineers so that people could take the time to check those mounds for mines with the detectors  and dissassemble them. So that they are useful in area denial with a clear counter, which would be the detector.
« Last Edit: 18-04-2016, 18:04:05 by Airshark79 »

Offline jan_kurator

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Re: AP-mine Gameplay
« Reply #27 on: 19-04-2016, 21:04:17 »
This is AP mines first 'nerf' if you wanna call it that. Afaik they haven't been changed since 2.0.
Deploy time was accidentaly shortened to 1sec in pre 2.45 times. This was reverted to the actual deploy times (fitting the animations) in 2.50 again.