Author Topic: alternative attack routes  (Read 1469 times)

Offline Martinlegend

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alternative attack routes
« on: 11-08-2014, 10:08:17 »
when i played Gold beach a few days ago ive seen the possibilty of bloweong up the concrete barrages and i thought maybe the mappers can add this to other maps for flanking out machine gun nests - only on specific Points 

i like this idea and maybe the mapper can add some Variation to the maps

Offline jan_kurator

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #1 on: 11-08-2014, 11:08:42 »
Maybe in the future, it's not going to happen on released maps as it would lead us to redesigning them and such task is too big for a small development team. Such changes aren't as simple as they seem to be.

Offline Martinlegend

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #2 on: 11-08-2014, 19:08:30 »
no Problem but maybe you can Keep it in mind  :)

Offline LuckyOne

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #3 on: 11-08-2014, 22:08:27 »
As I suggested in the past, this would work nicely in the bocage, parts of destroyable hedgerows that can be used to open up flanking routes.

Ideally you would be able to knock them out with the tanks equipped with hedge cutters, but that's probably not possible to do on this engine, or would require some serious hacking of the values (don't know how exactly the Materials system works here, but I suppose there's no way to create a material that will only interact with another specific one? Plus it would require redoing the tanks so I guess it's a no-go).
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Offline Martinlegend

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #4 on: 12-08-2014, 02:08:45 »
but I suppose there's no way to create a material that will only interact with another specific one? Plus it would require redoing the tanks so I guess it's a no-go).

that's why I would suggest the "charge-way" more :)
and it would also work on barbed wire (which is more used to getting on the nerv of players than everything other obstacle I think^^) like on Omaha beach where its perfectly fits into the map

Offline TGK

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #5 on: 11-09-2014, 16:09:09 »
IN regards to the boccage, surely bangalores were used for this. Another use for them!

Offline VonMudra

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #6 on: 11-09-2014, 20:09:35 »
Nope, they weren't.

Offline TGK

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #7 on: 12-09-2014, 03:09:46 »
So you're saying that immediately after D-Day, in the same area where boccage was an obstacle, and many bangalores had been present for the landings, there would NEVER have been a case where sappers would have used them to clear hedgerow? :_P

Offline Roughbeak

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #8 on: 12-09-2014, 05:09:15 »
So you're saying that immediately after D-Day, in the same area where boccage was an obstacle, and many bangalores had been present for the landings, there would NEVER have been a case where sappers would have used them to clear hedgerow? :_P

If I'm not correct, most of the times the Sherman tanks, with their hedge cutters, cleared the hedgerows or the Allies just went around them.

Offline TGK

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #9 on: 12-09-2014, 05:09:31 »
I was just being pedantic :) But I'm sure if the hedgerows were such an obstacle in that region there would have been sappers using explosives to breach them at points.

Offline VonMudra

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #10 on: 12-09-2014, 16:09:47 »
Oh, they did try breaching them with c4.  It failed miserably, as the bocage hedgerows weren't just tall bushes.  They were massively overgrown earthen walls mixed with stone walls mixed with incredibly tangled roots, all combining to form something nearly impassable.  Accounts of trying to blow them open exist, and it didn't work.  The only thing that did work to an extent were the hedgerow cutters, as those could slice through the root structure and thus clear a gap.  However even those were of limited success, as only around 100 tanks were ever fitted, and, as the first through the gap, they were often knocked out first too.

Offline Matthew_Baker

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #11 on: 13-09-2014, 04:09:43 »
Nice article on the Battle of St Lo but it tells about some early US hedgerow 'cutters' (more like logs):
http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USA/USA-A-StLo/USA-A-StLo-3.html
(skip to page 54)

essentially the tank would 'poke' holes into the hedgerow:

that engineers would then fill with dynamite or other explosives.

and subsequently blow the crap outta 'em 8)

sorry for the Off Topic :-X

On Topic: what Jan said

Offline VonMudra

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #12 on: 13-09-2014, 05:09:33 »
That's about the only way they could do it too.  Army wasn't exactly issuing jack hammers to front line units.

In the end, hedgerow hell was exactly that.  The hedgerows limited tactical flexibility for an attacker and greatly aided any defender.  FH2 has done a relatively good job showing that, with some allowances for gameplay/graphics (and sadly, missing some things altogether, like German bunker and trench positions built into the hedgerows themselves).

Offline Chad1992

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #13 on: 13-09-2014, 15:09:35 »
Yea I don't feel the hedge rows are used to their full potential in FH2.  Mainly because you can't see over the dang things.  It would be great to be able to use them for actual cover and shoot from behind the hedge rows.  I'm not saying they all have to be this way just more than there is now so that some places can actually be defended and the hedge rows would be more useful to infantry.  Another nice touch would be some MGs placed right on the hedge rows themselves.


Offline LuckyOne

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Re: alternative attack routes
« Reply #14 on: 13-09-2014, 16:09:22 »
Well the things were quite big, overgrown with heavy vegetation... Often over several meters tall. After all some were probably centuries old by that time. But yeah some medium sized ones would be nice for more variety.
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