Author Topic: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?  (Read 8826 times)

Offline Norman Rockwell

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 109
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #120 on: 05-07-2014, 00:07:08 »
We play the hell out of the small maps every Thursday night (and sometimes Saturday nights) (Eastern Standard Time - US) on the WaW server...


Offline djinn

  • Masterspammer
  • ****
  • Posts: 5.723
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #121 on: 05-07-2014, 01:07:25 »
OK, djinn, so you are arguing that some servers should adopt your ideas and then they will get populated too? Nice idea, but I think it will remain a dream unless you start a new server yourself and try it out. Maybe even then, btw.

I sincerely think that FH2 should be happy with it's playerbase, propagate the mod properly via the known channels (YT, Moddb, etc.) and try to appeal to people who love WWII more than anything. That's it. I don't think it is realistic to aim for a playerbase 10 times the size it is now, because the game (BF2) is simpy too old.

The system was proposed by the OP
i'm simply suggesting how it could work.

I see no reason why we should be contented with just one server honestly.
We did perfectly find when both 762 servers were running and HSLaN was still going.

It doesn't dillite the community. If anything it allows the devs to have more feedback to polish the mod and reason to keep developing the mod.

It also helps with recruiting more devs.

But beyond that, I think it just helps to have players from across the world able to find an active seever near them any time they wish to play.



The elitism that the mod being smaller ensures the roght caliber of people come in just doesnt hold up to scrutiny. If the mod has solid game mechanics, and I think it does, then those, NOT the player caliber will keep it being played the way it ought and actually give players a fresh experience each time.

Using the standard channels is all well and good, but if we could judt do that to grow numbers, we would alreafy have won't we. It helpe to expand, not stagnate IMO.

I feel this mod is beautiful and the gameplay is amazing, and I would honestly wish more people got to experience it

Offline Mudzin

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 692
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #122 on: 05-07-2014, 02:07:37 »
The problem is that hslan server was closed due to its emptiness...

Offline Slayer

  • Freeze Veteran
  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 4.105
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #123 on: 05-07-2014, 02:07:50 »
We did perfectly find when both 762 servers were running and HSLaN was still going.
Yeah, that was like two-three years ago when the playerbase was bigger still. People move on, get a life, etc. and then stop playing or play less than before. I have a kid now (I didn't two years ago) and I can assure you that it makes you play FH2 less. Does that say anything about the mod? No. Can more propaganda help me to play more FH2? No.

"My generation" was excited for BF2, but the generations after simply aren't because they grow mup with different games. BF4, if BF at all.

Using the standard channels is all well and good, but if we could judt do that to grow numbers, we would alreafy have won't we.
No. There is a lot going on nowadays. Yes, there has been a lull, but here is FB, Twitter, Moddb, YT, etc. now and they are all being used and they all have a responsible dev or beta tester to look after. [/quote]

I feel this mod is beautiful and the gameplay is amazing, and I would honestly wish more people got to experience it
I agree, but I think that, if we are looking for new players, we should look for older guys, in their late 20s and 30s (and older). New kids who will like this mod are rare at best.

Offline ksl94

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 739
  • British Imperialist
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #124 on: 05-07-2014, 03:07:12 »
I agree with you, Slayer. We should target an older and especially more professional audience. I was not a gaming person at all until I discovered FH2. To this day, FH2 is the only game I am playing regularly, along with the occasional RO2 and ARMA II.. Re-enactors, history graduates and all kinds of people who are interested in World War II. should be sought after. They, just like me, will play FH2 literally for the rest of their lives.

Offline Jimi Hendrix

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1.182
  • Knowledge speaks, but wisdom listens
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #125 on: 05-07-2014, 11:07:31 »
1st we need to keep the community we have right now.

 762 is carrying the FH2 banner by themselves & i salute them, but

 The 100 player code is buggy. The server crashes CONSTANTLY.

 Not to mention the mysterious CTD & whatever else goes on (i wont mention names here)

 The player base seems to be grouped as follows:

80% - European
10% - British
5% - American
5% - other

 The answer lies in Europe due to pings. I have fought Sargcorsi & Koenig for years with 100+ ping higher than them all for the love of this game.......but new players?

 This IS an old game. Even PR has fallen off in numbers & their community is split between super elite players on 1 server HOG (assholes) & some weird regular player servers called Candy Van (i dont get the joke)

 
 Im a fan of Normandy like everyone else. They are fun. Lots to do & they are noob friendly.

 Compared this to the excruciatingly boring African maps (El Alamein-Seige Of Tobruk-Gazala-Alam Halfa)
which requires a new player to hop in a tank and take on Irishreloaded or walk forever  & then throw in a server crash every 2-3 hours.

 762 should go back to (2) 64 players servers

(1) Western Front Only
(2) North African Front Only

 Throw in an occasional mappack. See which one stay more populated.



Im sure im pissing in the wind, but this is the truth like it or not.

 :-*
« Last Edit: 05-07-2014, 11:07:26 by Jimi Hendrix »



Offline LuckyOne

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2.716
  • Purple Heart Collector
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #126 on: 05-07-2014, 11:07:10 »
^ Not the truth. If they took your suggestion the Africa only server would be empty most of the time, and the 64p one would be full all the time. And the other 50 players would leave the game (forever) because they wouldn't have anywhere to play.

It's fine as it is. What 762 could do is make the other servers run a more variety of maps, for example one with custom maps thrown into the mix and one that plays smaller maps only, perhaps limited to 40-ish slots.

The truth is, 762 both killed FH2 and kept it alive. It killed FH2 by pushing out every other server because it hogged all the players and the admins that wanted to do the job. And it kept it alive by doing a good job on admining their server. They do listen to the players and are active, even if there are occasional issues and I don't agree with many of their decisions.
This sentence is intentionally left unfinished...

Offline Jimi Hendrix

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1.182
  • Knowledge speaks, but wisdom listens
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #127 on: 05-07-2014, 13:07:59 »
^ Not the truth. If they took your suggestion the Africa only server would be empty most of the time, and the 64p one would be full all the time. And the other 50 players would leave the game (forever) because they wouldn't have anywhere to play.

 Your words, therein lies the answer.

 Ty LuckyOne
 ;)
« Last Edit: 05-07-2014, 13:07:44 by Jimi Hendrix »



Offline Airshark79

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 453
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #128 on: 05-07-2014, 14:07:37 »
Further thoughts:

What I think we could actually do is to make sure that people who dislike FH2 for reasons don't have to suffer through their least favorite maps and some which are bound to disappoint, which vary between people, for example I love cobra and hate omaha, whereas others may hate cobra due to balance and love omaha for the landing action. So we can organise servers for categorization.

Here is a mockup of my personal categories:

(RO) Could be ruled out of the streamlined map rotation( The maps that mostly turn out to be not so fun)


----Bardia(RO),Keren,Giarabub,Sfakia,Olympus,FoTobruk,Hyacinth(RO),Tunis(RO),Crete(RO)----
----Sidi Rzeigh(RO),Gazala,Tobruk,El Alamein,Supercharge,Mersa Matruh(RO),Alam Halfa,Sidi bou zid,Mareth Line,Olympus----
----PdH,Gold Beach,Omaha Beach----
----Port en Bessin, Purple Heart Lane, Anctoville, PdH, Gold Beach, Omaha Beach, Lebisey, Ramelle Neuville, Falaise(RO due to mortars), Brest, Hurtgen, St Vith---
----Villers Bocage,St Lo,Goodwood,Cobra,Totalize,Vossenack,Luttich(RO),Bastogne,Meuse river----
----Eppeldorf,Vossenack,Bastogne,Meuse river,St Vith----


Along with these full mix of 762 will also keep going, because it is a working soultion.These six mixes' maps could be further decreased down to no-disappoint mixes(people who expect massive maps also need to be not disappointed):(This is really about my personal taste)



----Giarabub,Sfakia,FoTobruk----Africa Small scale inf.

----El Alamein, Supercharge,Sidi Bou zid----Africa Mixed Battles.

----PdH,Gold Beach,Omaha Beach----Invasion mix.

----Port En Bessin,Purple Heart Lane,Anctoville,Ramelle Neuville,Brest,Hurtgen----Best of West infantry mix

----Eppeldorf,Goodwood,Vossenack,Meuse River----West Mixed Battles

----Bocage,Vossenack,Bastogne,Meuse river,St Vith----West Grand Battles


Some of these will surely not work considering the rotation turns back around in Three hours and two el alameins are a bit too much, But like 7/24 Karkand, Suez canal, Gibraltar and metro did infantry focused rotations with as little bore as possible will keep the new players busy without being disappointed in their first run. A great time to initiate this is the time when Eastern front is introduced, because that moment will be a chance for a big public appeal to draw newbies and "the disappointed" back in for another try.

Also fluctuating numbers between servers is ok, but once there is only one option and the rest also being full mix servers, fluctuating numbers is decreased players.

@ ksl94: While the history buffs are a loyal bunch, not all who watched, and spoken fondly of Saving Pvt Ryan were them. Our modern counterparts with more focus on smaller bits of WW2 unjustfully get a hundred times more people than us.
« Last Edit: 05-07-2014, 14:07:18 by Airshark79 »

Offline Ts4EVER

  • Banner of THeTA0123
  • Developer
  • ******
  • Posts: 7.766
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #129 on: 05-07-2014, 14:07:10 »
Personally I like the fact that 762 runs all official maps. That being said, I wonder if it wouldn't be possible to do some kind of voting system, also randomized. So people have the choice between two or three maps from the rotation. That way we devs would also get numbers of which maps are requested most and which might need work.

Offline Harmonikater

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 370
  • Resident Crazy Composer
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #130 on: 05-07-2014, 14:07:39 »
To the python-cave!
I do bad things to the BF2 engine.

Offline LuckyOne

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2.716
  • Purple Heart Collector
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #131 on: 05-07-2014, 14:07:29 »
The voting system would be nice. Or at least the admins should run more votes when people start complaining.

And people need to stop bitching "this map is shit. This sucks. I HATE THIS!" and actually PLAY the game. It's not the map that makes the fun, it's the PEOPLE who PLAY the game.

I mean, theoretically you could put people on a 512x512 flat green plain with just grass and STILL have fun (for example having a big knife fight, or line battle or playing virtual tag or whatever)... IF people are up for it...
This sentence is intentionally left unfinished...

Offline Slayer

  • Freeze Veteran
  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 4.105
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #132 on: 05-07-2014, 14:07:30 »
It's kind of painful for me to see posts disqualifying certain maps because they are "unfriendly" or anything.

Apart from the fact that these maps have been worked on for god knows how long, and then someone comes in and simply says "this map sucks, take it out of rotation", I'm afraid this might lead to a situation which I already experienced at the end of BF1942: one server which ran one map 24/7 and one server which ran only ~5 maps. This was the final blow for BF1942, as players who disliked those maps, or players who liked the variety (one of the strongpoints for FH2 too!) left and never returned.

I sincerely hope that 762, or any other server for that matter, will never be tempted to remove maps from the rotation permanently, just because some people voice their dislike of them.

Offline Ts4EVER

  • Banner of THeTA0123
  • Developer
  • ******
  • Posts: 7.766
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #133 on: 05-07-2014, 14:07:47 »
My opinion on map quality: It varies between players. Some people really enjoy El Alamein or Cobra for the tank action, but can't stand Omaha Beach, even though it is an often requested map in general. That being said, some of the FH2 maps pre 2.3 would not be made this way today. That goes for 2.0 Afrika maps like Operation Supercharge, Mareth Line or Siege of Tobruk, which were made without much experience in BF2 map making, or maps like Villers Bocage or Olympus which were adapted rather hastily from tournament maps. We still update those of course (Gavrant is working on Cobra as we speak), but some of them have basic structural problems that are impossible to fix. Personally I would not be sad to see them played less.
On a related note: Is Crete still out of the rotation? Cause the transport plane steering thing was fixed  in 2.47.

Offline Jimi Hendrix

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1.182
  • Knowledge speaks, but wisdom listens
    • View Profile
Re: Player base development - How do we keep this mod alive?
« Reply #134 on: 05-07-2014, 15:07:47 »
To the python-cave!

 I lol and spat my drink out.

Note:

*I have never seen a server run 32 player maps only
*The answer lies in Europe & must come from there
*762 does have 2 other servers (PR 1.2 & Battleracer2) neither of which has any activity in the last 12+ months
*Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death.
 ;D



Alas, the solution is not an easy one, but if another server besides 762 were to step forth & read the entirety of this thread for ideas, he would fall asleep drooling before reaching its end.

 :-*
« Last Edit: 05-07-2014, 16:07:14 by Jimi Hendrix »