Author Topic: Less grenades  (Read 2848 times)

Offline evhgear

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 925
    • View Profile
Less grenades
« on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:10 »
Well, as the name of my topic says, I found that grenades are simply abusively over used on certain maps and it simply broke the gameplay and fun. Sometimes on certain maps like PdH or PHL, almost 1/2 of all kills are done by grenades(wich make about a total of 200kills per map), wich simply sucks.

I don't have all the knowledge of Murda in WWII History(Murda and WWII are the same person :P) but I don't think that all infantry soldiers where having 3 grenades with them. My suggestion is to only put grenades in the infantry kit with SMG, not the rifle kit. In Ramelle it work like that and in my memories this map doesn't turn in a grenade festival.

Another thing is about the range of german grenades. I simply found that this grenade can by thrown way too far. IRL, this grenade can be thrown at a range of about 30-40yards, but in game it more like 80yards. It arrives often that throwers are out of the range of SMG, wich it's simply ridiculous. Since grenades are defensive weapons, they should not be a weapon to kill people at about 100yards of the thrower. So simply reduce the range of grenades for all countries(even if mills bomb have IRL a range of about 30yards) and maybe their power since grenades in game have a quite large killing radius.

That's only my opinion, maybe I'm the only one to think that, but give yours, I want to see what people think of grenades.

Offline Josh094

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 1.629
  • Oh dear.
    • View Profile
    • ProjectBarrett
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #1 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:56 »
Mudra actually fought on every front, for every army, in every regiment and divison in the Second World War... 5 times.

In terms of the grenades the mapper decides what maps they should be on, for example i think Brest doesn't have any grenades (?).

I think the problem isn't with how many grenades people have, but with how many people have grenades on maps. So I suppose yes, giving grenades to only limited kits could be an option, but i assume FH is trying to represent a rifleman's true load out.

In terms of how far they can be thrown... Yes I suppose they do seem to be thrown quite a great distance but as I have never handled a full-weight grenade I don't know how far they can realistically be thrown..
« Last Edit: 16-02-2011, 19:02:35 by Josh094 »


Offline THeTA0123

  • The north remembers
  • Masterspammer
  • ****
  • Posts: 16.840
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #2 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:17 »
5 times officialy. There where also cover operations. Mudra is btw also chuck norris 1st student.
-i am fairly sure that if they took porn off the internet, there would only be one website left and it would be called bring back the porn "Perry cox, Scrubs.

Offline Torenico

  • Masterspammer
  • ****
  • Posts: 5.625
  • ¡Viva la Revolución!
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #3 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:39 »
Well, i dont know who is this Murda guy. I know Mudra but Murda? No clue.


There shall be less Grenades, sometimes i feel im nuking a flag with grenades..


Offline THeTA0123

  • The north remembers
  • Masterspammer
  • ****
  • Posts: 16.840
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #4 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:50 »
Personally i dont mind the amount of grenades. What i do mind is the rate you get resupplied with them.


One guy sitting at an ammo box and spamming mills bombs and Stielgranates.....awefull
-i am fairly sure that if they took porn off the internet, there would only be one website left and it would be called bring back the porn "Perry cox, Scrubs.

Online VonMudra

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 8.239
  • FH2 Betatester/Verdun Team Researcher
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #5 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:50 »
Having thrown reproduction stick nades weighted to weigh the same as a real German stick nade, I can say that the range they have ingame is, if anything, too little.  The stick design was specifically used to give it an incredible range over the egg style nades.  This is due, essentially, to different tactically doctrine.  The Germans, starting WW1, saw grenades as offensive weapons.  Thus they have little shrapnel, large explosive potential, and can be thrown quite far.  Egg grenades are of a defensive type, that is, its hard to throw them far enough that you'll be out of danger.  Thus, they usually have a small charge with lots of metal and shrapnel potential, and are meant to be thrown from a position of cover (thus a 'defensive' grenade).

Also, ingame, that's about 40 yards you're throwing the stick nade, not 100.  You aren't a very good judge of distance dude. :P

On the use of grenades, grenades were used almost more than rifles in the attack, especially by the Germans.  Stosstrupp in WW1, and pionier/FJ-pionier in WW2, had "waterwings", which were hung over their necks that were filled with grenades.  In german doctrine at least, the weapons that won the battle for the infantry were the grenade and the machine gun.  Rifles were only self defense weapons.

So essentially, the tons of grenade spam ingame is 100% correct.  The throw distance on the egg grenades is correct.  And the stick nades, if anything, should be thrown farther, and for the non-shrapnel ones, should have a much smaller cone of damage (german soldiers in WW1 would literally jump feet first into the blast to avoid concussive effects of it), and a much higher concussive blast, that should, if it doesn't kill, cause bleeding or extreme suppression.

Quote
The German Stormtrooper made expert use of the grenade from 1916-1918. Stormtrooper units were led in the attack by grenade throwers. These were the men with the strongest arms and greatest accuracy. In a battle within the trenches the grenade men would throw single or grouped grenades over or around corners. Following the explosions several men armed with the K98 short barrel carbines, pistols, bayonets, and sharpened shovels to finish of dazed defenders. The remaining members of the unit, in addition to carrying their own weapons, wore sandbags filled with grenades. Ernst Jünger recorded how he and other Stormtroopers would keep percussion grenades on one side and pull-cords on the other. During the attack Stormtroopers would pass grenades to the throwers at the front, with men replacing the throwers as they tried or were wounded, relentlessly pushing the attack forward.


While yes, this is on WW1, it was really little different in WW2, the same tactics applied.  The germans simply loved the grenade.
« Last Edit: 16-02-2011, 19:02:39 by VonMudra »

Offline Viktor2a5

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 241
  • Act natural act natural. We've done nothing wrong
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #6 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:21 »
And Mudra strikes again...

Offline THeTA0123

  • The north remembers
  • Masterspammer
  • ****
  • Posts: 16.840
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #7 on: 16-02-2011, 19:02:19 »
IMO you dont really have much advantage with the mills as a defensive grenades

Stielgranates feel like they kill at almost the same radius as the mills

The only real diffrence i see in blast radius, is the bomba a mano vs the mills.
-i am fairly sure that if they took porn off the internet, there would only be one website left and it would be called bring back the porn "Perry cox, Scrubs.

Offline mopskind

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 384
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #8 on: 16-02-2011, 20:02:27 »
I am okay with Handgrenades. What i find a bit silly is the amount of riflelaunchers and nades and the use of it.
I shamefully admit that i am one of these people who at the beginning of a round puts on a rifle nade to shoot it at the first enemy i see, even while running or jumping  ::)- thats because you mostly have one or two spare nades and it is way too easy to use them.
Maybe reduce the amount of them or make sure that one can just fire it while standing or crouching (thats how they were used IRL too IRC)

Offline [ret]azreal

  • Developer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1.618
  • Retired Developer
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #9 on: 16-02-2011, 20:02:40 »
Kits in FH2 have 2 grenades evhgear, not 3.

Offline Oberst

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 854
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #10 on: 16-02-2011, 21:02:13 »
Kits in FH2 have 2 grenades evhgear, not 3.

Most times the rifleman caries 3 grenades^^ (Is there a map with 2 grenades?)

One in the hand and 2 to "reload".

Offline Butcher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1.839
  • ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #11 on: 16-02-2011, 22:02:56 »
PLEASE, reduce the number of grenades on Tunis!  :'(

I dont even exaggerate when i say that tunis gets stuck 9 out of 10 times at the big wall (the one behind the flag that the allies always cap - not the first wall  ;)) with a shitload of grenade kills. the amount of grenades is of course already reduced, but still it seems there is to much slaughter when everybody is just grenade-whoring the other side of the wall.

so as suggested i would like to see either: - only the assault kit gets nades.

or: grenade kits that lie around ... like a sniper kit for example

edited: FOR TUNIS
He got banned for our sins. He was not the member FH forums deserved, he was the member we needed.

Offline Thorondor123

  • God Emperor
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6.573
  • Lugbûrz-ûr!
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #12 on: 17-02-2011, 00:02:19 »
Kits in FH2 have 2 grenades evhgear, not 3.

Most times the rifleman caries 3 grenades^^ (Is there a map with 2 grenades?)

One in the hand and 2 to "reload".
I'm quite sure that is not the case. It is 2, or 1 with the less grenades code.
Let mortal heroes sing your fame

Offline Eat Uranium

  • Tea Drinker
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 4.514
  • Today's news will contain [REDACTED]
    • View Profile
    • FH2 Music
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #13 on: 17-02-2011, 00:02:55 »
Kits in FH2 have 2 grenades evhgear, not 3.

Most times the rifleman caries 3 grenades^^ (Is there a map with 2 grenades?)

One in the hand and 2 to "reload".
I'm quite sure that is not the case. It is 2, or 1 with the less grenades code.
No, it really is the case.  The mills bomb, for example, has 2 versions.  The one with 2 grenades is used in assault kits, the one with three in rifleman kits.  This seems to have been dropped however.

Offline flyboy_fx

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2.132
  • rockets,rc stuff,and collecting/making ww2 models
    • View Profile
Re: Less grenades
« Reply #14 on: 17-02-2011, 04:02:06 »
I support limiting rifle nades. Those mofos suck.  ::)
Don't hate the forum, hate it's users...