Author Topic: Help us, help you  (Read 1729 times)

Offline djinn

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Help us, help you
« on: 19-10-2009, 22:10:30 »
So, I'm hoping this' not too technical, but I wanted to get a feel of the algorthm governing the AI of FH2.. in short, what are the bots' logical consderations for their actions - Perhaps we SP/COOPers can aid in that aspect

For instance:

Only SMGers and LMGers seem to fire from the sights while walking - What do bots consider that makes that the case...? Would other kits firing down the sites be far fetched to consider also?

What do riflemen consider when going prone? I know mgs and LMGs consider it a better firing position

How come mg gunners can't fire standing, but AT gunners can - Why don't they use the same logic to go prone?

Do bots in FH2, like FH1, have line of sights based on their kits eg... Why don't MG gunners see distant targets as fair game more often - Only use of a kit mg at logn range I ever experienced was in Fall of Tobruk, your baby, I beleive WinterH ;-)

Do bots in Fh2, like Fh1 consider proning as a means of cover from fire? eg. from airplane fire, tank fire, small arms fire?

What prevents bots using bandage? i.e just toss and keep moving... And hence, walk over it?

Why can't German bots use AT bombs?

Can FH2 bots, like BF2 bots use the wrench to remove enemy mines?

Why can't denfesive guns be destroy-repairable like in MP?

If I used a deployable kit like the lafette or mortar, will bots see it to mount it like FH1 bots?


Can something be done about bots not firing artillery? Even theaoretically? I know about the whole 'not able to fire past obstractions' thing... But any new theories?

Why can BF2 bots respond better to commands than FH2 bots? Was the code completely redone? I thought it used the same code, with snippets added for new weapons and vehicles and some improvements

What decides what kit a bot will chooose? Is it it like Fh1's kit based on demand?

BF2 bots, I thought had little issue with climbinbing stairs etc... Why are almost all buildings in Fh2... especially more recent maps, almost not at all pathmapped? Bots can spawn upstairs in almost all NA maps inclduing Tunis which was a result of the FHSP, but in almost none if not not even one 2.2 map

Now I don't intend to gripe or be a pian, but I really want to help where I can to make Ai that much better.... And if hope is to be lost, I will be the first to lose it when the time comes

We might not have anything better to say than you already have considered, but at least Spers and COOPers can be there to understand the limit or potential of the engine.




Offline cannonfodder

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Re: Help us, help you
« Reply #1 on: 20-10-2009, 09:10:10 »
Quote
Do bots in Fh2, like Fh1 consider proning as a means of cover from fire?

I've seen bots hit the deck, but I don't know if it was for cover or if they were doing it to get a better shot.

Quote
Can something be done about bots not firing artillery?

I'm no expert, but I reckon the only way would be to get the bots to spot, e.g. have them equip their "weapon" (binocs) and "shoot" (spot). You'd have to man the arty yourself, but it's better than nothing.

But doing it like this, if it can be done at all, would mean somehow limiting the amount of times they spot/shoot. Otherwise you'd end up with dozens of targets to sift through.

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What decides what kit a bot will choose?

I've always figured it's either a random thing or they cycle through the kits as they respawn.

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Why are almost all buildings in Fh2... especially more recent maps, almost not at all pathmapped?
That's a lot of pathmapping... ;)


I improved my AIX and POE2 bots (haven't tried it on FH2 yet.) by changing this line in my AIBehaviours file...
Code: [Select]
aiSettings.setVehicleDefaultBehaviour Infantery        Idle
...from 'Idle' to 'MoveTo'.

See this link for more info...

http://www.battlefieldsingleplayer.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=14263
« Last Edit: 20-10-2009, 09:10:29 by cannonfodder »

Offline Zoologic

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Re: Help us, help you
« Reply #2 on: 20-10-2009, 18:10:09 »
Quote
What do riflemen consider when going prone? I know mgs and LMGs consider it a better firing position
Do bots in Fh2, like Fh1 consider proning as a means of cover from fire? eg. from airplane fire, tank fire, small arms fire?

I see some bots go prone just like cannonfodder observed. I think this is because they have been damaged by nearby explosions or being shot at. I see FH1 bots go prone when being fired at.

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What prevents bots using bandage? i.e just toss and keep moving... And hence, walk over it?

I believe the bots don't understand their own condition atm. BF2 medic bots can see other's health bars and heal others when requested or just seeing someone is injured (less than 70%). This is the case with medic bots, but FH2 does not have medic class and no class seems to be able to see friendlies' health status.

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Why can BF2 bots respond better to commands than FH2 bots? Was the code completely redone? I thought it used the same code, with snippets added for new weapons and vehicles and some improvements

I think it is because of the change of the commo rose command. They used to understand as much commands as BF2 bots' do.

Offline djinn

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Re: Help us, help you
« Reply #3 on: 21-10-2009, 00:10:44 »
Bots never responded apprioporately to many commands... Bots in BF2 could follow you directly if you asked them to or stop if you requested a pickup

The re-arrangement of the rose to what I must call a shitstick is really more a cosmetic sort than an underlying design change - I doubt that's the issue.... It's just sad to see FH2 bots more repsonsive to so many other things and yet not to basics that vanilla did so well

Even FH1 tank bots would stop if you shoulted 'wait', even if not 'I need a pickup'

The commo-rose I hate, I've been pretty verbal on that fact... but this time, I dare say it isn't the issue - Stress of the word, 'dare'

sure hope I can get some understanding of these issues so we can be more proactive with AI in FH2

Offline Zoologic

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Re: Help us, help you
« Reply #4 on: 21-10-2009, 12:10:55 »
Yeah, but i am certain that bots in previous FH2 versions used to understand the basic commands such as "go go go" and "need pickup", in which they will reply yes and do related actions.

My other observation regarding bot behavior is their direct attack against armored units with AT-mines. It seems vanilla BF2's bot behavior, where you could just throw the mine standing or kneeling and it became active once deployed. Engineer bots do attack vehicles with AT mines. What happens in FH2 is that, as i observed in all of the maps with armored vehicles, they charge you holding AT mines, get close, and then move away, wait in a distance and still holding the mine. They actually didn't plant the mine, because you need to be prone in order to do so. In Vanilla BF2, you'll see that they'll throw the mine, and if you move, you're fried meat. But in FH2, the bots maybe just trigger a "fire" action but the mine wasn't deployed because they were not proning.

This is as quite disturbing as the behavior of "charging the tank while holding the AT mines" is already strange  ;D

Other thing is about bot's repairing vehicles. I read somewhere in this forum, that the wrench has caused problems in some maps. But particularly in Luettich, they actually repaired my truck. And still that weird "I need a grease monkey!" unnecessary shouting by the bots in vehicles with full health (even bicycles and tractors).

Offline djinn

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Re: Help us, help you
« Reply #5 on: 22-10-2009, 12:10:17 »
Indeed - I won't want them to be able to drop mines standing - I already hate their use of AT rifles - Makes the PZII all but useless since i8t can be literally charged by rambos weilding AT rifles taking the recoil in a perfect jog