Forgotten Hope Public Forum

Forgotten Hope 2 => Normandy maps => Feedback => Operation Totalize => Topic started by: Toddel on 07-09-2009, 21:09:19

Title: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Toddel on 07-09-2009, 21:09:19
"If you have a suggestions or want to give us some Feedback about this Map you can Post it here!"
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 08-09-2009, 03:09:57
Was this map just based in layout on Operation Harvest BF2 map, or was it actually directly imported, reworking statics and textures, but leaving terrain intact? I only realized it had the same layout while driving over the river from the South and seeing road bridge next to RR bridge, and then it dawned on me, I checked the map and layout, including two Southern uncaps, exactly the same. :) Nice Easter egg.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Herpes911 on 08-09-2009, 06:09:05
Nice map.  But I think it could benefit from some sort of push mode.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: [130.Pz]S.Lainer on 08-09-2009, 10:09:35
Nice map.  But I think it could benefit from some sort of push mode.

Give those poor Canadians a chance man!
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Fenring on 08-09-2009, 11:09:11
Was this map just based in layout on Operation Harvest BF2 map, or was it actually directly imported, reworking statics and textures, but leaving terrain intact? I only realized it had the same layout while driving over the river from the South and seeing road bridge next to RR bridge, and then it dawned on me, I checked the map and layout, including two Southern uncaps, exactly the same. :) Nice Easter egg.

Its based on the same layout/terrain but all statics, textures, growth, light and watershader are new.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Herpes911 on 08-09-2009, 14:09:20
Nice map.  But I think it could benefit from some sort of push mode.

Give those poor Canadians a chance man!

Well, actually I said that from having played the Canadians.  It's very frustrating to have most of your forces on the other side of the river and have factory and/or windmill back-capped, since the distances between flags are greater on this map (unlike, say, Falaise Pocket).
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 08-09-2009, 15:09:16
But you have to remember that you canadians can backcap the german flags south of the river aswell. ;)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: [130.Pz]S.Lainer on 08-09-2009, 16:09:33
Nice map.  But I think it could benefit from some sort of push mode.

Give those poor Canadians a chance man!

Well, actually I said that from having played the Canadians.  It's very frustrating to have most of your forces on the other side of the river and have factory and/or windmill back-capped, since the distances between flags are greater on this map (unlike, say, Falaise Pocket).

  Ahh then your problem seems to be dumb Canadians.  Sorry to say there is just no hotfix for dumb.  People will get it after some more play time I think.  I myself have been a total nub playing Totalize.  I always want to be a hardcore team player on this map but there is just something in my head that says "No Lainer!  Screw your squad!  Grab the Shrek and lone wolf it across the river.".
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Fuchs on 08-09-2009, 18:09:15
Love this map, only thing would be to ditch the river as it's not part of the real Totalize as far as I know.. You can recreate it with hedgerows and a 'cliff'.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 08-09-2009, 21:09:58
Yeah I kinda agree with Fuchs about the river. Its the only thing that divides the gameplay and usually cuts the flow of play, people will start sitting in their tanks and wait for someone to make a move across. I think it could be just normal terrain so the initial push is on through the countryside and not through bottlenecks.

BUT I do agree its also sad to remove it because Sorken made the bridge for it. Personally tho, I would lean to no river option, while I still dont mind it being there. But as it is now, many times I am leading a massive canadian tank charge in my cromwell and I have shermans and churchills following me as we storm to factory and then to windmill, but when I start my attack to south through the shallow parts, I always end up being alone because the rest are pansies and are afraid of kittens lurking in the vegetation. If it was no clear "barrier" and bottleneck, I think more people would keep on these attacks and not leave me (or anyone who does this like me) face the dangers by themselfs.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Slayer on 08-09-2009, 21:09:26
Lots of players still think you can only cross by one of the bridges, believe me. This will change.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 08-09-2009, 21:09:25
Aye now that you mentioned it. That could be one of the reasons they wont cross the shallow areas.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 09-09-2009, 04:09:55
Well, actually I said that from having played the Canadians.  It's very frustrating to have most of your forces on the other side of the river and have factory and/or windmill back-capped, since the distances between flags are greater on this map (unlike, say, Falaise Pocket).
Well, that’s why you leave people behind to defend. Granted, back flag duty might not appeal to many people, but as a part of overall teamwork it’s invaluable. It’s not a map balance issue, it’s issue of people recognizing priorities and doing what’s best for the team.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Herpes911 on 09-09-2009, 07:09:00
Well, actually I said that from having played the Canadians.  It's very frustrating to have most of your forces on the other side of the river and have factory and/or windmill back-capped, since the distances between flags are greater on this map (unlike, say, Falaise Pocket).
Well, that’s why you leave people behind to defend. Granted, back flag duty might not appeal to many people, but as a part of overall teamwork it’s invaluable. It’s not a map balance issue, it’s issue of people recognizing priorities and doing what’s best for the team.

I was defending all by my lonesome  :).  But anyways, I just suggested the push map thing since most maps in the mod seem to have it to some degree.  Or maybe at least have it so you need more than one person to cap it.  But I'm generally ok with it either way, I just wont sit back and defend next time it comes up :P.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: NTH on 09-09-2009, 10:09:42
Yeah I kinda agree with Fuchs about the river. Its the only thing that divides the gameplay and usually cuts the flow of play, people will start sitting in their tanks and wait for someone to make a move across. I think it could be just normal terrain so the initial push is on through the countryside and not through bottlenecks.

BUT I do agree its also sad to remove it because Sorken made the bridge for it. Personally tho, I would lean to no river option, while I still dont mind it being there. But as it is now, many times I am leading a massive canadian tank charge in my cromwell and I have shermans and churchills following me as we storm to factory and then to windmill, but when I start my attack to south through the shallow parts, I always end up being alone because the rest are pansies and are afraid of kittens lurking in the vegetation. If it was no clear "barrier" and bottleneck, I think more people would keep on these attacks and not leave me (or anyone who does this like me) face the dangers by themselfs.

This is why we have smoke shells. I wish people realized that what works IRL, smoke obscures sight, also works in FH2.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 09-09-2009, 12:09:31
Its a luxury you dont take into account too often.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.GN_Angrybeaver on 09-09-2009, 12:09:03
i would like to see the planes respawn  a bit quicker.
with all those flaks/wirbelwind and focke wulfs you often dont live very long with the typhoon.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: General_Henry on 10-09-2009, 03:09:02
Yeah I kinda agree with Fuchs about the river. Its the only thing that divides the gameplay and usually cuts the flow of play, people will start sitting in their tanks and wait for someone to make a move across. I think it could be just normal terrain so the initial push is on through the countryside and not through bottlenecks.

BUT I do agree its also sad to remove it because Sorken made the bridge for it. Personally tho, I would lean to no river option, while I still dont mind it being there. But as it is now, many times I am leading a massive canadian tank charge in my cromwell and I have shermans and churchills following me as we storm to factory and then to windmill, but when I start my attack to south through the shallow parts, I always end up being alone because the rest are pansies and are afraid of kittens lurking in the vegetation. If it was no clear "barrier" and bottleneck, I think more people would keep on these attacks and not leave me (or anyone who does this like me) face the dangers by themselfs.

good tankers on firefly/achilles would immediately bust any kittens that open fire.


and smoke, spottersm commander arty.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 10-09-2009, 13:09:00
Yeah, GOOD firefly/achilles tankers...
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: el Garstico on 12-09-2009, 17:09:02
mabe you can fix the rails, because its very easy to derail in the bend.
(http://img5.imagebanana.com/img/xuu6dor/screen049.jpg) ;D
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 12-09-2009, 19:09:24
mabe you can fix the rails, because its very easy to derail in the bend.
That should be probably reported as a bug.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: [130.Pz]S.Tiemann on 13-09-2009, 06:09:10
Yes train car for the win! does it steer off of the tracks?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kev4000 on 14-09-2009, 02:09:11
Sacrifice your tank for the greater good! storm the other side of the river.
Based on first impressions, its rather hard for Canada to capture the other flags, or atleast hold them. However, most maps change their balance dramatically as people learn better strategies. Give it a while, and see if the balance changes.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Ts4EVER on 14-09-2009, 13:09:13
I saw the Canadians cap all flags recently.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Ionizer on 14-09-2009, 13:09:41
Just today/last night the Canadians capped and held all flags.  Partially because the Axis airforce sucked and they forgot to man their AA guns, but it is possible.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kelmola on 14-09-2009, 14:09:25
the Axis airforce sucked
This. They came in straight and level, and pulled out likewise. Slow enough that I could drop a 190 with the Windmill's 88. And they hardly bothered to suppress AA at all. (At least I assume we were in the same game, because I haven't yet seen Axis take such a beating on Totalize yet.)

To be honest, though, the German side seemed to lack coordination. There seemed to be no concentrated push across the river, only individual, unsupported backcappers going for Factory and/or Windmill and beaten back. Also, when the lone German trying to recap FlaK Battery was slain, the flag remained uncontested for like minutes until there was a wave of Canadians. After Canadian tanks settled on top of the Artillery Battery, with the southern PaK on the FlaK Battery hill sideshotting the kittens coming in from the SW uncap, it was all but over.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 15-09-2009, 01:09:54
Right now in general teamplay is hit and miss. 2.2’s Normandy brought out of woodwork bunch of noobs, even by BF2 standards and it gets frustrating (no artillery spots, poor tanking/flying etc.). They still need to learn a lot, to get real “wow! factor” out of FH2 with its sometimes epic battles. We just need time.

P. S. 2.2 brought out idiot teamkillers who run around hacking own teammates for no good reason — I haven’t seen those for years even in BF2 and 2142.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Josh094 on 16-09-2009, 22:09:05
Map was ok.

IMO far from the best one in the mod. Simply because for me, it doesn't feel like a real place. It seems to busy. Too many hills and vallys etc. It doesn't feel like normandy to me, it feels like a arcade/vanilla map (granted it is a vanilla heightmap) Goodwood is the ultimate tanking map for me, not Totalize.

Maps like Goodwood, Falaise, etc Feel like Normandy, look like Normandy and are believable.

So for Totalize i'd give a 6-7/10
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Rawhide on 22-09-2009, 15:09:22
i would like to see the planes respawn  a bit quicker.
with all those flaks/wirbelwind and focke wulfs you often dont live very long with the typhoon.
I like it the current way, because it gives Air supperiority for a few minutes. Not just for short seconds until the other lad is up again with his plane to give it another try.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Josh094 on 22-09-2009, 18:09:04
Sorry, unrelated...

I love your sig'

Guns of Brixton
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: [F|H]Uffeh_SWE on 22-09-2009, 21:09:06
This map is quite imbalanced IMO.

The Allied airforce doesn't stand a chance vs the Flak Vierlings, FW's AND Wirblewind.
That is transfered to the ground ofcourse as the bomb carrying FW can take out all allied tanks whitout  disturbance.

I'm curious: Why the Wirblewind on top of the Awesome FW, Flak36's and Flak Vierlings?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 22-09-2009, 21:09:37
Simply because in testing sessions the planes are flown by the right hand of God himself and it seemed to us that the german panzers are constantly getting their asses pasted all over the pavements whenever they tried to leave their bases... this of course is only my point of view and not anywhere near official reasoning.

I thought the map plays out just fine.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: [F|H]Uffeh_SWE on 22-09-2009, 22:09:08
If only God had two right hands so they could fly a FW and a Typhoon at the same time...
You'd get another result I promise. ;)

Who is this guy you are talking about? Is it Lightning or w/e he's called?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Eat Uranium on 22-09-2009, 22:09:18
Its unlikely to be the dreamcrusher.  I doubt that the microwave disguised as his computer is very conductive for god like flying skills.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 23-09-2009, 02:09:25
The Allied airforce doesn't stand a chance vs the Flak Vierlings, FW's AND Wirblewind.
Depends who’s flying. I’ve had rounds where Typhoons positively owned the battlefield. Sitting in the flak usually lasted less than a minute cause allied pilots attacked them on sight (whether there’s someone manning them or not, they just used preventative measures). If you had 2 seconds to get out alive after the cannons whiz all around you, t’ was lucky.

I would actually say that allied planes have leg up. I haven’t flown Typhoon, but, for instance, Beaufighter has superior field of view than Stukas or Messers, and much easier to use zoomed. At least for me.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: NTH on 23-09-2009, 11:09:46
If you have played the maps a few times, you'll the positions of the vierlings.
The Spitfire can defend the Typhoons against the FW109's.
Only one left to counter the Typhoons is a well hidden and constantly reocation Wirbelwind.

So yes for me this map is balanced and I enjoy it playing Allied or Axis.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 25-09-2009, 23:09:09
Meh, this map is far from balanced. I have played it so many times, with many diffrent teams, and only twice did we won.

First of the allied planes are nothing against this armada. FW190 can outturn any of the planes and are way faster. Then we still have the Wirbelwind, The Flakvierlings, and not to forget the double'd in performance Flak 18. Of wich their are 5 on the map.

Nah, this map really needs a change on the airforces. This map is Very difficult for the allies. Germans win the far majority of the time
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kelmola on 29-09-2009, 09:09:29
I don't think the perceived imbalance in this map is so much dependent on the air forces, rather than the strange behaviour of the Canadian team. All too often, they behave like the German team once did in an earlier match (see my comment above).

On several matches I have witnessed, the Canadian offensive goes smoothly, until the Factory and the Windmill have been captured. At this point, still bleeding, the Canadian team goes into defence mode. Apart from a couple of backcappers, nobody seems to make a serious push across the river. (Well, in one match the Canadians did eventually take the artillery battery and the farm - too late to have any effect, and still leaving FlaK battery in their back.)

I have seen this result with both Allied and Axis air superiority. Speaking of which, superiority here is more dependent on pilot quality rather the hardware available. A good FH2 pilot learns where the enemy AA is and tries to neutralize that first before attacking tanks or infantry - nothing is more vulnerable than a plane pulling up from an attack run. Also, the Germans rarely manage to hold all AA positions, so the firepower will be quite equal quite soon.

I am still of the opinion that the air war is in balance, the issue is poor tactics and lack of coordination.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: NTH on 29-09-2009, 10:09:20
Meh, this map is far from balanced. I have played it so many times, with many diffrent teams, and only twice did we won.

First of the allied planes are nothing against this armada. FW190 can outturn any of the planes and are way faster. Then we still have the Wirbelwind, The Flakvierlings, and not to forget the double'd in performance Flak 18. Of wich their are 5 on the map.

Nah, this map really needs a change on the airforces. This map is Very difficult for the allies. Germans win the far majority of the time

First thing I do is take out the 88 out the factory. This give the tanks the chance to roll in fast.
Second I go for the Vierling at the windmill. The other Vierlings I don't come close too because we need to cap the Factory and Windmill flags first. Other targets of opportunity are tanks and FW109 (if caught off guard).

Really if the Typhoons would have it easier it would be a slaughter for the German tanks.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 30-09-2009, 12:09:56
Yes but the problem lies that their are so many Flak38 Flak 18, the wirbelwind and the FW190 that if you dont pay attention for even half a second, ur shot down. Thing is, the Germans can cover their flyboys everywhere on the map. Allies can only keep their planes backed up at the mainbase. That is the reason, why the Allies mostly lose operation totalize. Thats why i first asked that the allies also get their Self-proppelled AA gun, otherwise, having one puny spitfire more, doesnt give a damn.

Operation totalize is good. Very good. I love it, but the allies barely win it.

Also another hint for the allies=Capturing the flak battery and the other flags across the river first is the best strategy imo. I sat in Desert-Rat his squad, in a Hslan squad. And this was the best strategy. I think i played Op totalize 40 times now, and i think the allies won 2-3 times.

Still, it is the best Normandy map. I happily play it, anytime, anyday.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Die Happy on 30-09-2009, 13:09:52
most ting i read here is allied flyboys crying because they got shot down  because there is so much AA on the map.

yes there is much AA on the map but no one seems to care that both sides can use it.
repair the vierlings / 88 at captured flags and use the freshly liberated equipment against their previous oppressors.  what then is left is 1 wirbelwind and the superior FW190.

and yes those AA can be harmfull for the typhonns but they are stactic. fly high make a dive fire 2 rockets and get out. AA destroyed and repairing takes  a few minutes.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Ts4EVER on 01-10-2009, 10:10:15
I think people are still adjusting to this one. I can't comment on the plane physics issue, but I noticed a certain German air superiority that seems kinda odd in the historical context.

One of the Vierlings can fire directly at the Nebelwerfer at Artillery battery. I don't know which one it is because I have only seen the rounds incoming, but you certainly should look into that.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: NTH on 01-10-2009, 11:10:01
Yes but the problem lies that their are so many Flak38 Flak 18, the wirbelwind and the FW190 that if you dont pay attention for even half a second, ur shot down. Thing is, the Germans can cover their flyboys everywhere on the map. Allies can only keep their planes backed up at the mainbase. That is the reason, why the Allies mostly lose operation totalize. Thats why i first asked that the allies also get their Self-proppelled AA gun, otherwise, having one puny spitfire more, doesnt give a damn.

Operation totalize is good. Very good. I love it, but the allies barely win it.

Also another hint for the allies=Capturing the flak battery and the other flags across the river first is the best strategy imo. I sat in Desert-Rat his squad, in a Hslan squad. And this was the best strategy. I think i played Op totalize 40 times now, and i think the allies won 2-3 times.

Still, it is the best Normandy map. I happily play it, anytime, anyday.

My dear Belgium friend you are not listening to what I say. There is one Vierling you should be worried about in the beginning of the map. Take out the one at the windmill and you only have to worry about the wirbelwind.
The other vierling you don't come close too until your mates have taking the factory and windmill flags.

And yes you stand a fighting chance against the FW109, just make sure you get the drop on those guys.

The reason why the Allied don't win this map more often is that they dig in after having captured the first three flags.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kelmola on 01-10-2009, 11:10:57
I think people are still adjusting to this one. I can't comment on the plane physics issue, but I noticed a certain German air superiority that seems kinda odd in the historical context.

One of the Vierlings can fire directly at the Nebelwerfer at Artillery battery. I don't know which one it is because I have only seen the rounds incoming, but you certainly should look into that.
At least the Windmill Vierling has a clear LOS to the hill housing the Artillery battery. The Nebelwerfer might be just out of sight (don't remember exactly), but thanks for the tip. I will have to try "walking" the fire across the hilltop, it's bound to hit something eventually ;D

As for the amount of flak, well, this is not Crete where AA guns are locked to one side only. Put to good use in the hands of a new owner, the Vierlings and 88s will keep the skies clear of FW's as well. Generally, the Factory and the Windmill tend to fall very quickly (before the Germans have had time to counterattack), so they could almost be counted as Canadian AA. Also, the FlaK battery on the western side of the river is easier to capture than the Artillery battery (less open ground to cross), so if the Canadians have a decent team, they will end up controlling the majority of AA fire before the halfway of the round.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: TheLean on 04-10-2009, 15:10:06
Altough the Fw190 is a much better dogfighter than the typhoon, as it should be, the new hitboxes makes it easier to kill planes from odd angles than before. You can attack the FW190 from the side and quite easily score hits.

I dont understand the talk about to much german AA. If you fly in the AA zone ahead of the front lines you have to use some commons sense and realise it might not be the most efficient way of surviving in air. If you want to attack behind the frontlines, sneak up in the red no go areas on map where there are no ground forces. The only real treath to allied air on this map is a good pilot in the FW190. He might kill you directly or force you into a dogfight over enemy territory where AA can kill you. All other things such as flak and MGs can be avoided or dealt with by using tactics. Even the whirblewind gunner can be killed relatively easily. If you are able to survive his first attack attempt, you know where he is and you can use that advantage to launch a suprise attack from directly above out of the clouds and kill him with the cannons.

To gain knowledge of enemy flak and AA, move in lines across the map, with 100 meters closer to the front each time. This will often cause the vierlings and whirblewind to fire too early for hitting effectively. Now you know where they are and now you can flank them and kill them. Also, make a ruitine of strafing the 88´s and flak vierlings to constantly keep them destroyed. Often you get a kill as an engineer is trying to repair them.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Fuzz on 06-10-2009, 16:10:39
I always use the wirbelwind in this map against allied plane and they had no chance all time.
The allied needs to rush on Flak first and than cap the two flags on the north of the river.

But this map needs to be more bigger. The used part its to small i think.
More vegatation will be fine, like trees and hedges in goodwood. Take exemple on Goodwood i think this is the best map who show the environement from the caen plain.

But what part of city or place you had based your work?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 06-10-2009, 19:10:20
Totalize is fiction based since the heightmap is made by DICE.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 06-10-2009, 23:10:02
Totalize is fiction based since the heightmap is made by DICE.
If people bothered to read the topic they are answering into, we would have less (dumb) questions.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Fuzz on 07-10-2009, 13:10:06
Ok sorry for my question, i had forgotten this fact.
Eh it's for that FHdev map are more beautiful  ;)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Capten_C on 17-10-2009, 14:10:22
On Totalize I notice there are 2 Tiger colour schemes, what's the story?
Tanks turrets are 222 (light colour) and 132 (darker, and a work of art btw!)
Are they both the same PzKpfw VI Ausf. E "Tiger" (late)? Or is one an early PzKpfw VI Ausf. E "Tiger"  ???
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Josh094 on 17-10-2009, 14:10:41
Both the same, just different texture. :)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Capten_C on 17-10-2009, 15:10:28
Thankye Sir  :)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: W4lt3r on 04-11-2009, 18:11:41
I tend to fly around in this map a lot and notice that 70% of the time, most allied pilots cannot stay up for longer then 30 seconds and some might not even be able to take off, since the 3 bofors in allied main is nearly ALWAYS unmanned, not to mention lot harder to score hits on those planes compared to Vierling / Wirbelwind.

Several times i've seen the FW190's baserape a lot (even though it's OK at hslan, i still find it very annoying). And someone mentioned the 190 being able to outmaneuver any plane the allies have, i beg to differ.
At this moment the spitfire seems to possess the highest maneuverability, with 190/109 coming to 2nd and typhoon/hurricane after that.

Problem is the community, no one wants to sit around in mainbase bofor for whole round, just to get ripped to shreds by the 190's.

Infact I have never witnessed an allied victory on this map. Probably related to the size and rather close positions of the bottlenecks, which can be rather easily defended by Tiger + King Tiger + the northeastern side 88mm at Flak Battery. Especially if the 190's can keep those Typhoons down.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Slayer on 05-11-2009, 00:11:50
I understand you don't like to lose, but I really feel sorry for allied teams who still go to the factory first and then to windmill. Try to think of something else, it will bring you victory. I have won this map as Canadians several times, I think the outcome until now has been something around 50/50. And almost always the score is something like 25-0, or 17-0 or something like that. Which means it was a good fight, and that's what counts.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: theUg on 05-11-2009, 11:11:21
If you attack Flak battery in the beginning of the round, it’s quite easy to cap it, cause most germans are across the river still, and not a lot of people sit there.

BTW, last round I’ve played on Totalize, Canucks won, cause they managed to keep one of the southern flags capped/grayed for the most of the round.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.GN_Angrybeaver on 05-11-2009, 16:11:16
i would like to see the planes respawn  a bit quicker.
with all those flaks/wirbelwind and focke wulfs you often dont live very long with the typhoon.



i declare,i was wrong with that!
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Seth_Soldier on 05-11-2009, 17:11:06
I agree about baserape.
Baseraping is ok from time to time (you need to destroy artillery and ennemy planes) but it seems it is became the only tactics of all the pilots.
Consequently, there no more support at all,even the artillery is empty.

I don't like the run&gun and flag hoping so i prefer a support role (aa, artillery, ammo, etc ...). But sometimes, it really piss me off to be the only aa or artillery and being baserape every 30 sec.
Bofors is harder to manned, even with 3 manned bofors, i doubt it will change somethings, a fw190 will know where there are and will kill them all before they react.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: General_Henry on 10-11-2009, 13:11:34
I tend to fly around in this map a lot and notice that 70% of the time, most allied pilots cannot stay up for longer then 30 seconds and some might not even be able to take off, since the 3 bofors in allied main is nearly ALWAYS unmanned, not to mention lot harder to score hits on those planes compared to Vierling / Wirbelwind.

Several times i've seen the FW190's baserape a lot (even though it's OK at hslan, i still find it very annoying). And someone mentioned the 190 being able to outmaneuver any plane the allies have, i beg to differ.
At this moment the spitfire seems to possess the highest maneuverability, with 190/109 coming to 2nd and typhoon/hurricane after that.

Problem is the community, no one wants to sit around in mainbase bofor for whole round, just to get ripped to shreds by the 190's.

Infact I have never witnessed an allied victory on this map. Probably related to the size and rather close positions of the bottlenecks, which can be rather easily defended by Tiger + King Tiger + the northeastern side 88mm at Flak Battery. Especially if the 190's can keep those Typhoons down.


the 88 is a killer to planes if the guy on it knows how to use it.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: W4lt3r on 10-11-2009, 13:11:02

the 88 is a killer to planes if the guy on it knows how to use it.

I do know personally the power of 88's shells. Been on both ends. I just cant get the grip of the Time fused HE shells so i tend to shoot HE/AP at those flyboys and even tend to hit them.
Didn't Germany get their hands on proximity fused Anti-Aircraft shells or was that strictly for US only in the Pacific front?

I mean it's 1944 and all, at least i suppose the bofors ought to have the proxy-fused AA shells with slight area of effect damage (not too high though) to balance out the AA issue tad bit.

But the map feels quite small for such wide-range of weapons engagements. I could even imagine that map as max light armor + unarmored vehicles and infantry fighting with mortar support and perhaps a 109 + spitty / hurricane..
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 25-11-2009, 18:11:03
I understand you don't like to lose, but I really feel sorry for allied teams who still go to the factory first and then to windmill. Try to think of something else, it will bring you victory. I have won this map as Canadians several times, I think the outcome until now has been something around 50/50. And almost always the score is something like 25-0, or 17-0 or something like that. Which means it was a good fight, and that's what counts.
Completly not true. I played Operation Totalize many and MANY teams. With bad teams and good teams. The germans win the far majority of the time.

If the canadians go for the Windmill/factory flag, they are screwed.

However, if the canadians rush the flakbattery and artillery battery, Then their is an even chance of victory.

The map is very good, i love it, even though the axis win most of the time. Some little tweaks and changes on both sides and this map is +9000 to play
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Slayer on 25-11-2009, 23:11:46
I don't recall having played with you on the same server, but since I wrote that, nothing changed for me. It is still something like 50/50 overall, but last 4 times I played Totalize, I won all of them. One time being axis, three times being allied. Two of the allied victories were total ownage: 239-0 and 244-0.

Your post confirms what I wrote: if Canadians go for the opposite side of the river, the fighting chances are much better. Whenever I played it was like this: in cases where they succeeded, they won the map.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.GN_Angrybeaver on 26-11-2009, 16:11:19
i rember a situation with the lumberjacksquad a few days ago.
we capped the flakbattery and the hq in the first 5 minutes of the game,but almost nobody spawned at the flags to support us,everybody went for factory.
at least we could hold for 5 minutes,but got overun.
end of the story: axis could built up there defences on their side of the river and we got camped to death.
round lost and angrybeaver was seriously angry
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: :| Hi on 29-11-2009, 06:11:29
Angry, I think I saw you say the "Your mother was a beaver" insult  :o  It was pretty funny how a few people responded.         Totalize is the map with the train, no?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.GN_Angrybeaver on 29-11-2009, 17:11:07
Angry, I think I saw you say the "Your mother was a beaver" insult  :o  It was pretty funny how a few people responded.         Totalize is the map with the train, no?

hrhr ;D ,yes its the map with the train
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: :| Hi on 29-11-2009, 18:11:39
I wish they would get rid of the windows in the back of the train  >:(   , I always get killed by some canadian toting an mg through that window
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Seradest on 03-12-2009, 21:12:16
ok this is the only Map in FH2 that lag on my PC

my Ping is 23ms on hslan server

My System:

Vista 64bit Ultimate
Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 2x 3.00GHz
3GB DDR2 800hz
Ati HD 3850 512mb

the lag is so strong that i became only every 2-3 secounds a pic of that what i see...........

in all other maps my fps are so good that i can play the game very smooth

please make a performance update or a map fix or something i love this mod and played very often with my friends in teamspeak 2.

Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Paasky on 04-12-2009, 02:12:25
ok this is the only Map in FH2 that lag on my PC

my Ping is 23ms on hslan server

My System:

Vista 64bit Ultimate
Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 2x 3.00GHz
3GB DDR2 800hz
Ati HD 3850 512mb

the lag is so strong that i became only every 2-3 secounds a pic of that what i see...........

in all other maps my fps are so good that i can play the game very smooth

please make a performance update or a map fix or something i love this mod and played very often with my friends in teamspeak 2.


Must be spyware, slow hard drive or hard drive fragmentation, cause I have the same except E6750 & HD3850 256mb, and I don't get bad lag on any maps. Drops to 30-40fps though, which is why I'm upgrading this x-mas.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: General_Henry on 09-12-2009, 16:12:15
I understand you don't like to lose, but I really feel sorry for allied teams who still go to the factory first and then to windmill. Try to think of something else, it will bring you victory. I have won this map as Canadians several times, I think the outcome until now has been something around 50/50. And almost always the score is something like 25-0, or 17-0 or something like that. Which means it was a good fight, and that's what counts.
Completly not true. I played Operation Totalize many and MANY teams. With bad teams and good teams. The germans win the far majority of the time.

If the canadians go for the Windmill/factory flag, they are screwed.

However, if the canadians rush the flakbattery and artillery battery, Then their is an even chance of victory.

The map is very good, i love it, even though the axis win most of the time. Some little tweaks and changes on both sides and this map is +9000 to play

I think the map is tough for canadians if both teams are equally good. (this is the underlying assumption)

First: Germans enjoy a advantage of sitting high, this allows them to monitor the entire battlefield on just the arty battery. Try it if you don't believe, you can see almost everything on that hill. It's of decisive advantage if you know where enemies are going.

Second: Any German armour could tear apart the allied tank force while the allied tank force takes much more skill to do so. (e.g. you can defeat an entire tank assault with a single marder, or just a single PaK gun, while it's not possible to do so as a Sherman)

Third: Germans tanks spawn closer to the flags(note the "s") compared to canadians


one wild possibility is,

Make one of the flags unrecappable for Germans, one good candidate would be the factory, how annoying it is when just a SL bailer or someone sneaky ruin your good ticket bleed upon the Germans.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: phillip on 15-12-2009, 16:12:54
imho, make the current totalize the 32 version (kind of like PDH 32 is just a 64 counterattack).  And do a bigger totalize as a new 64 with much more of the OOB removed.  The Forest/hills in the north west are fun to fight in.  Same with the south west of the secondary german mainbase.  Moar Armor, mOar Planes, moAr flags/bigger flags, moaR fun.

 :)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 17-12-2009, 21:12:46
Things have improved recently. The public has finnaly learned that the first 2 flags are bad
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: sniper77shot on 24-12-2009, 18:12:17
I would love to see the first 3 flags be able to be taken by the Canadians when there capped they cant be taken back by the Germans.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Heinrich (Mr.Uniwersum_GER) on 24-12-2009, 18:12:09
Verry good map Its my favorite map.But I think the germans shuld have 1 Panther more.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Slayer on 24-12-2009, 19:12:04
I would love to see the first 3 flags be able to be taken by the Canadians when there capped they cant be taken back by the Germans.

The battle this map is about was a failure for the allies. I think we can't represent that by unrecappable allied flags...
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 26-12-2009, 17:12:49
Verry good map Its my favorite map.But I think the germans shuld have 1 Panther more.
TOTALLY NOT please! Panthers are far to strong already!

I'de rather say trow out the marder and toss in a Stug, but not a panther.

imo the vehicle layout should be based on this info of the 12SS Panzer Devision

Quote
At the beginning of June 1944 the division was declared ready for combat operations. The Division's tank strength at this time was 81 Panther and 104 Panzer IV tanks. The division was also equipped with Jagdpanzer IV tank destroyers, three prototype Wirbelwind flakpanzer vehicles, along with a number of 20 mm, 37 mm and 88 mm flak guns, Hummel, Wespe and sIG 33 self-propelled guns and regular towed artillery pieces.

This was the equipment the 12th SS panzer devision had in  june 6th1944
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Heinrich (Mr.Uniwersum_GER) on 27-12-2009, 02:12:20
But the canadians have so many tanks. Many people say the poor canadians but thats not right, they are strong enough.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 27-12-2009, 13:12:45
But the canadians have so many tanks. Many people say the poor canadians but thats not right, they are strong enough.
12 tanks vs 9 german tanks

2!   2 have the SAME firepower as the german tanks

10 of them are armed with guns wich require 2 SHOTS on the side of a panther to kill it.6 shots on a tiger tank!
The germans have the far advantage of this map by digging themself in on one side of the river and claiming the match

Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.totaler_humbug on 28-12-2009, 22:12:16
They got 3 tanks to effictivly fight any german tank.
Germans got all their tanks to effectivly fight any canadian tank.

Just think a little bit about it ;)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Timmay9/11 on 05-02-2010, 16:02:01
Has anybody noticed that you can abuse the Flak Vierling very easily on this map?

Well, it is no problem to fire to the Flag next to the Nebelwerfer, that way an intact FlakVierling can somehow “control” that Flag.  Destroying the Nebelwerfer is no problem and due the “splashdamage” of the Flak itself, its not a big deal to get some kills by just firing some greetings to that position once in a while.


or is this not a problem?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Flippy Warbear on 05-02-2010, 16:02:45
What flak vierling...?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Timmay9/11 on 05-02-2010, 16:02:36
that near the Flag at the Windmill
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.totaler_humbug on 07-02-2010, 23:02:56
Do the same with the Crusader AA
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hankypanky on 12-02-2010, 18:02:32
It would be interesting if the Canadians get a flag, with some good Anti tank guns on it. Just something that keep some of the German tanks at bay. However overall I have no problems with this map, its fine the way it is.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: psykfallet on 13-02-2010, 15:02:18
please, make factory uncap when allies got windmill, it's too easy for germans to constantly drive a kubel behind and cap that flag
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 15-02-2010, 15:02:13
please, make factory uncap when allies got windmill, it's too easy for germans to constantly drive a kubel behind and cap that flag
Ye i agree.   Windmill should still be cappable, but at least Factory should become uncappable once windmill is captured aswel

Also, will the Germans get Pak43/44 in the future? These AT guns where present in decent numbers during totalize. One is even pictured in the loading screen (The one destroyed with the cromwell in the background)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Ts4EVER on 15-02-2010, 16:02:45
Yeah, one could replace one or more of the 88s with the PAK, thus also making allied airpower a bit stronger.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 16-02-2010, 11:02:19
I believe either arty battery or Windmill should recieve one of these. Windmill already has a Flak vierling. And ALL german flags have one or  2 AA guns, it is simply a bit to much atm.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: TigerAce on 06-05-2010, 13:05:03
on what maps is the AA crusader on?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Ts4EVER on 06-05-2010, 13:05:29
on this one.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 06-05-2010, 20:05:45
It spawns on the west allied main base.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: ajappat on 17-05-2010, 19:05:50
Something weird happened to this map on 2.26. This map used to play perfectly with around 50-70 fps for me, but now it's 10-20 fps. Seems kinda weird, as I just bought more RAM and were able to raise settings alot. Anctoville for example used to run for 5-20 fps, but is now over 50 most of time. Has anyone else had issues with totalize on 2.26?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 17-05-2010, 19:05:29
WHO TOUCHED MY CHURCHILL?.
(http://www.gamerdna.com/uimage/Jgay9A1/full/tf2-heavy.jpg)

Did you guys changed something on the churchill tank hisarmor? I could withstand 4 shots from a Panzer IV and now i died in only 2 shots!

Quote
* Update churchillmkiv_75mm hit points.  Bug #1448 (spitfire)

WHAT you GUYS DID?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: TigerAce on 19-05-2010, 12:05:16
Could it be because the panzer 4 was using Pzgr40 rounds?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 19-05-2010, 13:05:16
Could it be because the panzer 4 was using Pzgr40 rounds?
Possible yes now i rethink about it..
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kubador on 19-05-2010, 16:05:49
Churchill armor wasn't changed, only the hitpoints. Now chiil and don't act like the churchill is actually yours.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 19-05-2010, 16:05:23
Churchill armor wasn't changed, only the hitpoints. Now chiil and don't act like the churchill is actually yours.
Its weaker now. It gets killed by one shot by tiger.........
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: luftwaffe.be on 19-05-2010, 16:05:55
as it should be :P
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 19-05-2010, 17:05:24
as it should be :P
Not beyond 1000 meters  ;D
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hslan.totaler_humbug on 19-05-2010, 19:05:58
It could get killed oneshot since 2.2 . I did this all the time.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Smiles on 23-05-2010, 12:05:55
Yea i dont see your problem. I also survived two shots of a panther (bad aiming yes).
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: TigerAce on 24-05-2010, 10:05:31
In a churchill i managed to survive 3 shots from a tiger, at 50 metres
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: :| Hi on 29-05-2010, 08:05:53
A tiger round bounced off my jeep ;-D
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Aggroman on 05-06-2010, 12:06:51
THeTA0123, you know that Canadians didn't use Churchills after the Dieppe landing failed?
So instead of complaining that it's weaker, you should be happy that it is even on the map. :P
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 05-06-2010, 14:06:51
THeTA0123, you know that Canadians didn't use Churchills after the Dieppe landing failed?
So instead of complaining that it's weaker, you should be happy that it is even on the map. :P
I withdraw everything i said. Because i was misguided. Forgive me
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: General_Henry on 26-06-2010, 08:06:19
It is very possible to one shot a Churchill, even in the front, with a 75mm gun of stug/marder...
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 26-06-2010, 09:06:48
It is very possible to one shot a Churchill, even in the front, with a 75mm gun of stug/marder...
another fine reason to remove PZG40 ;)


Just kidding. i thought the hitpoints where changed but they wherent. Subject closed
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: General_Henry on 27-06-2010, 06:06:41
It is very possible to one shot a Churchill, even in the front, with a 75mm gun of stug/marder...
another fine reason to remove PZG40 ;)


Just kidding. i thought the hitpoints where changed but they wherent. Subject closed

I haven't tried the regular AP, but it seemed to be 1s1k too if you hit that spot.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Potilas on 12-10-2010, 12:10:41
Airplanes are too dominant force. 2 typhoons can easily keep down gerries heavy armor count. Only hardcore veterans can provide solid protection for the tanks. FW190 with the bomb can get too decisive role when pilot master the bombing. There is nothing really to stop it, maybe good crusader aa tanker can keep him away from doing harm. Replace one typhoon by spitfire and take away bomb from the FW190. There is plenty of soft targets what can destroy by just aircraft gun, so I dont see that airplanes become powerless.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: THeTA0123 on 12-10-2010, 16:10:29
2 FW190's + all those flak vierlings + Flak 88 + Wirbelwind complety rape those 3 planes

Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: naoko on 06-12-2010, 16:12:22
this map error for SP when map loading :'(
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Slayer on 06-12-2010, 21:12:35
Better post this and the other map crashing for you (Lebisey?) in the Single Player forum: http://fhpubforum.warumdarum.de/index.php?board=63.0
I wouldn't know which thread/topic is best, as I rarely use that forum myself.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kwiot on 02-03-2011, 20:03:10
I got inormation from documentary film that Operation Totalize was launched during the night. Is this possible to make this map in night or this map tooks place day after the 1st night of operation?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Thorondor123 on 02-03-2011, 20:03:46
The operation lasted for days. There is no need to turn Totalize into a night map.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: :| Hi on 18-10-2011, 04:10:29
Could we get the factory to be a one-time cap?  ::)


And possibly the tigers to spawn after factory cap, or to eliminate the "back road" to the factory the tigers always use?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kwiot on 26-09-2012, 20:09:24
Today appeared strange ticket bleed bug - when Canadians managed to cap 3 flags, Axis started bleeding very fast to 0 (like on this push maps when the last flag is being capped).

Also I think there's not enough tickets - it is now 500-500 and map ends really quick even when theres only half full server. Op. Goodwood has 1000-1000 for example....
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: hyperanthropos on 27-09-2012, 19:09:05
Today appeared strange ticket bleed bug - when Canadians managed to cap 3 flags, Axis started bleeding very fast to 0 (like on this push maps when the last flag is being capped).

Also I think there's not enough tickets - it is now 500-500 and map ends really quick even when theres only half full server. Op. Goodwood has 1000-1000 for example....
Had the same thing with the tickets, dont know if we played the same round. And I had the exact same thought about the ticket ratio. Is good for a half fulls erver but, a full one, way to short.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: United_Stealth on 08-01-2013, 15:01:25
Sometimes when I want to spawn at the tanks in the german western base, I obviously select the most western white dot. Though I spawn at the planes and vice versa. This is a small thing, but sometimes annoying and it makes the choice between spawning at the tanks or planes a bit obsolete.
Again it's a small thing, but not necessary imo :) pls fix, or is there a special reason for spawning at the 'wrong' place?
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: gavrant on 09-04-2014, 15:04:16
Sometimes when I want to spawn at the tanks in the german western base, I obviously select the most western white dot. Though I spawn at the planes and vice versa. This is a small thing, but sometimes annoying and it makes the choice between spawning at the tanks or planes a bit obsolete.
Again it's a small thing, but not necessary imo :) pls fix, or is there a special reason for spawning at the 'wrong' place?
Will be fixed in the next 2.46 release, thank you for reporting.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: LtJimmy on 14-04-2014, 22:04:52
Could we get the factory to be a one-time cap?  ::)
And possibly the tigers to spawn after factory cap, or to eliminate the "back road" to the factory the tigers always use?
Just been playing this map on the WaW server and this right here. Germans backcapping all the time is seriously irritating (had 2 people quit that round because of it).
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: jan_kurator on 15-04-2014, 04:04:26
One way cap sounds like very limited gameplay idea to me but I think we can consider some kind of a push code (not the sector push), so under some conditions it could be recaptured but not always.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Matthew_Baker on 15-04-2014, 04:04:26
One way cap sounds like very limited gameplay idea to me but I think we can consider some kind of a push code (not the sector push), so under some conditions it could be recaptured but not always.

I've always wanted a push code for this map. (every map imo :P) but yea it can get very frustrating as Canadians sometimes. You need 3 flags to stop the bleed. That means factory/windmill (easiest to get on their side of the river) and then its very hard to push across the river under camping tigers to get that 3rd flag; that's made even harder when there is a SL (or some random guy who creates a squad) hiding way East of Factory and spawning out faust wielding Germans to sneak up on the flag :P

In the end it's just an annoyance but overall this map is very balanced and fun imo. Combined arms with a well loved BF2 heightmap makes for good gameplay imo :)
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Kelmola on 15-04-2014, 08:04:35
After all these years people still do not realize that the key is to ignore Factory & Windmill and go straight for FlaK Battery? Only after you get a strong foothold across the river should you consider taking the back flags.
Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: gavrant on 08-02-2016, 14:02:41
2.5 changelog for Operation Totalize 64

Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Ts4EVER on 13-06-2016, 17:06:48
2.52 changelog for Operation Totalize 64

Title: Re: Operation Totalize 64
Post by: Matthew_Baker on 11-05-2020, 17:05:02
2.56 changelog Operation Totalize 64

-Updated Cromwells to be Polish Cromwells

Spoiler
(https://i.imgur.com/cuuXQfa.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/4H6yWxG.jpg)