Forgotten Hope Public Forum
Off-Topic => Off-Topic => Topic started by: ksl94 on 20-04-2012, 15:04:49
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Good Afternoon,
today 20 Spitfires were found in the original crates they were shipped in. They were buried in 1945 since the RAF had no use for them anymore and that method was considered more cost-effective than bringing them back home as surplus. Probably this decision saved them from being destroyed. Note that we are talking about the very rare Spitfire XIV.. HOW AWESOME IS THIS!? :D
http://global.fncstatic.com/static/managed/img/Scitech/Ray_Flying_Legends_2005-1.jpg
Full story: http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2012/04/19/buried-treasure-in-burma-squadron-lost-wwii-spitfires-to-be-exhumed/
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Wow nice, thats indeed pretty awesome ! :D Gotta be so exciting for the people who get them out of the crates and take a look at them after all those years
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Really awesome! So how will the ownership be handled? Does he get the ownership, or they still officially belong to RAF?
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As far as I know, the lad who found them is the righteous owner, since the RAF decomissioned and "disposed" them. I think that none of us can imagine how happy he must be :P . I SO look forward to seeing them fly again-which should'nt take too long at all. As far as I am informed, they are in good/superb condition. I gues they could be made airworthy in less than a week :D .
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Wow if that's true it must feel like hitting a jackpot (and as far as I'm aware it is like it, a single Spitfire is probably worth a few million $$$).
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That is good news.
Next mission finding an crate in russia full of stukas ;D, that would be epic, largely because there are only 2 stukas left.
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Wow. Imagine what this is like to people who fly/restore Spitfires? The number went from 35 to 55. It must be a dream come true to them.
Also, really? Pushing such symbols of British military tenacity and skill into the ocean? BURYING an AIRplane? That just seems wrong.
Maybe they thought a flying island would grow out of Spitfire seeds...
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I would suck, the price of your expensive plane would just go into free fall with a doubling of the total amount left.
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Wow! What a fantastic news! Imagine what these persons felt when they found the crates and their content practically intact! :D
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IMO, mk. XIV is one of the best looking Spitfire around. It still has the original razorback spine, elliptical wings, original V-stab shape, and ROLLS ROYCE MERLIN!
The fact that it has more prop blade makes it looks cooler than its predecessor to me.
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^ Surely you meant RR Griffon, Zoo?
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What makes things even more awesome is that this was one of the most powerful type of spitfires ever made. These were ridiculously rare-only around 2000 were produced :o . When you find 20 of them in NEW, unused condition... I'd say you had more luck than you'd need to win the lottery :P .
Personally, I deem this the most spectacular find of WWII. related equipment EVER. It kind of lets you hope that more events similar to this one took place. Imagine if there's still even more vehicles/aircraft buried or hidden somewhere... Well, that would be overwhelming, I'd even say mind-blowing.
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This find will make this model the LEAST rare now, and the most invaluable. Keep it in mind.
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I wonder if there are more aircraft and tanks like these laying around buried on various small Pacific islands...
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IMO, mk. XIV is one of the best looking Spitfire around. It still has the original razorback spine, elliptical wings, original V-stab shape, and ROLLS ROYCE MERLIN!
The fact that it has more prop blade makes it looks cooler than its predecessor to me.
Oh shh... thanks LuckyOne
Mk.XIV should be this one (except the clipped wing, which is very rare):
(http://www.deroeck.co.uk/Spitfire-pictures/Spitfire-Mk-XIV-JE-J-04.jpgp)
Non-razorback, no original V-stab shape, no RR Merlin....
But it has elliptical wings and more prop blades (than the original 3)
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It's still going to take a great deal of time and energy to get them airworthy after they are exhumed. Sixty years spent underground will completely ruin any machine. Although they may not have been in direct contact with the soil, moisture will still have worked its way in to wreak havoc on the delicate mechanical parts of the aircraft.
I really really hope they can get these returned to England and restored, but it's going to be some time before we see these planes flying if everything works out alright for them ;)
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It's still going to take a great deal of time and energy to get them airworthy after they are exhumed. Sixty years spent underground will completely ruin any machine. Although they may not have been in direct contact with the soil, moisture will still have worked its way in to wreak havoc on the delicate mechanical parts of the aircraft.
This might not be so bad, as you can read in the ful story:
The planes were shipped in standard fashion in 1945 from their manufacturer in England to the Far East country: waxed, wrapped in greased paper and tarred to protect against the elements.
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This might not be so bad, as you can read in the ful story:
The planes were shipped in standard fashion in 1945 from their manufacturer in England to the Far East country: waxed, wrapped in greased paper and tarred to protect against the elements.
Ahh very nice! Hopefully this was effective! My only point was don't be overly optimistic about pulling them out of the ground and putting them straight on the runway ;D
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I imagine they're rather like boxed Mosin-Nagants. Hopefully at least.
I want one.
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Well mate,
I think we are really lucky here. As far as I know, the aircraft are almost perfectly preserved. 8)
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This find will make this model the LEAST rare now, and the most invaluable. Keep it in mind.
That may be true, but in my opinion, the more Spitfires, the better ;) .
And in that condition, I guess that they will still be incredibly expensive (they are new-absolutely new!)
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given the understanding that these planes are being recovered by the British government, there is little chance that any will be put up for sale. The UK protects its' history well and will ensure these planes are given their due respect.
It will make the battle of Britain fly-pasts very epic though.
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Well, this morning the situation was unclear and I thought that the recovery was to be done by the guy who found them.
But I guess that the British government will take good care of them, too... At least I hope so. :P
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The UK protects its' history well and will ensure these planes are given their due respect.
then why did they scrapped the entire royal navy after ww2? minus one light cruiser?
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The UK protects its' history well and will ensure these planes are given their due respect.
then why did they scrapped the entire royal navy after ww2? minus one light cruiser?
That is one of those things that anger me a lot. The Empire had lost the last bit of its military might after WWII. (HM Armed Forces are still standing strong and are still well equipped, but to be honest they are are a mere shadow of what they were before) After the war many other things went down the drain in the UK,too.
But that's a different story. I just hope that everything goes well regarding the export of the Spitfires... :-\
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20 Spitfires at once are some awesome find.
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The UK protects its' history well and will ensure these planes are given their due respect.
then why did they scrapped the entire royal navy after ww2? minus one light cruiser?
obsolete,
that and the need for steel to rebuild a shattered nation.
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The UK protects its' history well and will ensure these planes are given their due respect.
then why did they scrapped the entire royal navy after ww2? minus one light cruiser?
obsolete,
that and the need for steel to rebuild a shattered nation.
Couldn't they get their resources by sucking dry their colonies like they had done before?
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Which colonies do you speak of?
The major suppliers of Britain during WW2 were either neutral, sovereign countries, or emancipated colonies. (examples include Sweden, Spain, Portugal, America, Venezuela, Canada)
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Wow, I guess this is one of those stories then. Amazing.
But Myanmar ey? As in: one of the few remaining closed up dictatorships in the world (even with the current reforms). How big is the chance that they'll actually get them to let them out of the country? I hope they can make it work.
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They export 90% of the world production of rubies, so I don't see why they would mind some old plane parts which they have no use for being brought out of country, as long as the money's right.
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I just read 20, and went wow. Then I read in the box. Which is obviously better than burried in a swamp after crashing.
Very, very cool 8)
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Wow, I guess this is one of those stories then. Amazing.
But Myanmar ey? As in: one of the few remaining closed up dictatorships in the world (even with the current reforms). How big is the chance that they'll actually get them to let them out of the country? I hope they can make it work.
The Spitfire recovery while started by one man alone, has now become a national effort. The British government and the Burmese (don't ever call them Myanmar) are working at the state level in order to effect this recovery operation.
Burma is a fucked up country but with a pseudo-democracy they are compelled to participate, mostly to distract the world from what they are really up to.
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Burma is a fucked up country but with a pseudo-democracy they are compelled to participate, mostly to distract the world from what they are really up to.
What are they really up to?
There is a military junta reigning the country for decades now, suffering horrible losses in wealth and economic power each year. Seems to me, that they have reached a point where there is nothing left to take for their own advantage and comfort, while a 3rd class caribbean country could occupy the country in a single strike. So I guess they're just saving their own asses from the danger of getting blown away by granting small steps towards democracy. Or is there anything else?
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For starters, the Junta is violently suppressing numerous rebellious tribes (like the Karen), How can one say they are democratic when the people who want freedom are not granted such a privilege? It's a very hypocritical situation IMO.
Secondly, the human conditions in Burma are far from ideal. Human trafficking is rampant (Burmese prostitutes in Northern Thailand, fishermen as well, in fact the U.N. has offices in Thailand and Laos to deal with the numbers) and freedom of expression as well as economic opportunities are tightly controlled by the elite.
Phones are bugged, internet is censored, email is filtered, the economy is highly constricted, and the Buddhist religion is heavily monitored.
Thirdly, the environmental situation is rapidly deteriorating mostly because of Chinese hydro-electric projects that are not vetted but there are also concerns about the development of the Burmese offshore oil reserves. With no governmental oversight, a poorly educated workforce and no corporate standards to speak of, Burma is well on its' way to some major environmetal disasters.
Tropical hardwood forests are disappearing, Fresh and Saltwater fishing is not regulated, and the warfare in the east has allowed thousands of hectares of land to be lost for generations from landmines and unexploded ordinance.
Given Burma's latest developments, there is a chance for peace but there still remains a possibility of a South Asian equivalent to the "Arab spring" as long as the Burmese civilians are not allowed to live their lives without fear.
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I agree and i dont think there is much else. No clue what they are really up to.
Military regime gave the people a president last year to make them compliant and as far as I know the militaries do not support educational institutions.
People can't just go to university and study what they want to. They are afraid that people get to educated, that the students build fraterneties or unions that realize what is going on and start to protest. A social and economical disaster.
Most people are poor and are probably farmers that have bigger problems than the political situation.
In the end it all comes down to power again. The military gouvernment does not want to give it away and can just keep it up by staying militarically strong.
I assume they use old weapon systems though, maybe they plan to add the spitties to their military armory :D
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I imagined in the past that those Japanese pilots would be surprised that some Allies planes are as or even more maneuverable than theirs'.
Spitfires are one of the most maneuverable fighters in WW2.
On Myanmar, where the Spits has been found
I should warn you that "their democracy" doesn't mean Apple inc, or Toyota, or Vivendi Universal, or General Motors, or JP Morgan Chase could dive in and do whatever they like there (free). Or good hotels and entertainment centers for medium-wealth tourists will be opening soon in Rangoon. Or flock of Burmese internet users supplying us with their unique local memes.
It could be Bolivia, it could be Argentina: Narrow-minded nationalists who fooled the masses by blaming the outsiders for their own incompetence and problems, because it is the easiest and popular with absent-minded simpletons. At least in ASEAN (South East Asia), such thought is still 50-50, between them and those who just accept the situation as it is. Generally poor low-class Asian mud farmers are about 50-50 hardworking, modest-subservient people that is very adaptable, not inflated ego liberal hipsters who think that "we deserve to be rich/have it, because we were simply born into this world."
The only thing that can "check" those elitist is their strong belief in right-or-wrong morality (which is heavily influenced by their culture). For example, if your elitist leader is transvestites/homosexual/murderer/rapist (which is easily unpopular amongst them), expect Arab spring with internal support. Others like corruption, environmental destruction, adultery, would be difficult to respond and some will probably say "I would do the same if I'm in his/her position." And last, oppression is just a matter of perspective (labours probably yes, but farmers probably no).
Religion could be a problem though, because I believe that people listen to the preachings more than government propaganda. That's why they are monitored. As far as I'm concerned, Buddhist is a very very neutral, passive "not-giving-a-fuck" type of teaching (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_way). But some monks are inherently human, thus some still has the "attachment" to the real world out there and play a bit of politics. Because Buddhist keep preaching about "happiness (http://www.visiblemantra.org/allhappy.html)."
Aung San Suu Kyi is very strong, but I'm afraid that all those foreign support will make her feel obliged to listen to their demands. It could be popular and unpopular amongst the euphoria of her supporters. The only thing that can brighten their future is to continue with the slow reform overtime. Political prisoners freed, right to strike granted, and more to come.
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Clarify some things here,
BURMA is not keeping the planes, as part of opening diplomatic relations the Spitfires will help to garner favour from the U.K. The favour from Britain will be returned probably through enhanced culturalé tourist ties and ideally for the Burmese junta, the opportunity to have an ally in the EU which will help extend the holiday from sanctions.
@ Zoozoo,
Buddhism is both the main problem and the main saving grace for the Burmese people. They need some warrior monks rather than the ultra-passive format of Buddhism that they exercise.
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The same guys who found these spitfires, have a lead to a new location where 36! spitfires are buried in a simular fashion. They have leads to other sites aswel. But the locations are undisclosed to prevent them from falling into the wrong hands
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Also, do not call Burma "Myanmar." The name was changed by the ruling Junta, and even the people of Burma refuse to support the name change. Burma is Burma, and the name "Myanmar" is just a junta fantasy.
In 1989, the military government officially changed the English translations of many colonial-era names; among these changes was the alteration of the name of the country to "Myanmar". The renaming remains a contested issue.[11] Many opposition groups and countries continue to use "Burma" because they do not recognise the legitimacy of the ruling military government or its authority to rename the country.[12] Various non-Burman ethnic groups choose not to recognise the name because of the association of the term "Myanmar" with the majority ethnic group, the Bamar, rather than with the country.[13][14][15]
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Also, do not call Burma "Myanmar." The name was changed by the ruling Junta, and even the people of Burma refuse to support the name change. Burma is Burma, and the name "Myanmar" is just a junta fantasy.
In 1989, the military government officially changed the English translations of many colonial-era names; among these changes was the alteration of the name of the country to "Myanmar". The renaming remains a contested issue.[11] Many opposition groups and countries continue to use "Burma" because they do not recognise the legitimacy of the ruling military government or its authority to rename the country.[12] Various non-Burman ethnic groups choose not to recognise the name because of the association of the term "Myanmar" with the majority ethnic group, the Bamar, rather than with the country.[13][14][15]
I call it Myanmar because my friends, who are from there, call it Myanmar also. And yes, they have escaped there because of the junta.
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Also, do not call Burma "Myanmar." The name was changed by the ruling Junta, and even the people of Burma refuse to support the name change. Burma is Burma, and the name "Myanmar" is just a junta fantasy.
Yeah, and my remark referred to the government in charge now, not to whatever ideological or ethnicly correct name should be the right one. So...Spitfires, ey? ;-)
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Refugee's from Burma are commonplace throughout the planet, it's very easy to tell their age by the name they use for their country.
Let's hope they find more buried treasures elsewhere. P38's anyone?