Author Topic: Proof god exists  (Read 13064 times)

Offline Tedacious

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #60 on: 23-04-2010, 21:04:27 »
So much I want to say, so much flaming I want to do. But no real energy to spend an hour wiriting an essay in anger.


God does not exist. I am an atheist (I do not "believe that there is no god", definition of atheist is "to know that there is no god", and that's what I do).
I in a way depsise people who are religious. you will just say that i'm "a pathetic atheist pushing down all religious people" etc.
THat's not my opinion, in my opinion I am just realistic. There is no god and I can't understand how anyone can think that there is, IMO they are very simplistic and the definition of what I believe is the folly of man, generally weak-minded, cowardly and gullible.


just a really really short summary of my opinions.
I see were you are trying to reach: "how can a 17 year old kid have such a thinking like this? why doesnt he wants to be like normal teens who whana get rich? and his plan actually makes sense, but is too damn revolutionary and good at the same time than is still doubthfull if it works..." - Damaso

Offline Mr.Deceptive

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #61 on: 24-04-2010, 00:04:00 »
I don't personally get irritated, because those people are wrong. If somebody told me that I had blond hair instead of my brown hair, I would say "what no" because they are wrong. It's the same thing. They are just flat out wrong.

Belief in god is fear in god. You use it as a last resort because you have no other way of dealing with your situation, which is called lack of education/information. In my opinion it is extremely immature.

"Belief in god is fear in god" oh there we go again, yep another one that dont know shit what he is talking about.

note: I am neither christian nor ateist, I am still trying to find the "truth". (90% I will be flamed to death)

I know exactly what I am talking about.
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Offline Kelmola

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #62 on: 24-04-2010, 00:04:32 »
I know how much most of you guys hate religion and religious people so why even argue?
I do consider myself to be religious. But I see religion as a personal experience, even more intimate than sex, and that is why people often confuse me for an atheist - because I do not like to talk religion. But anyway, now that we're talking, to me religion is something that happens between a person and God(s) (s)he believes in. And that is why I kind of detest institutionalization of religion. (A good example - according to Bible, Jesus basically wanted to get rid of priesthood, strict dogma, and temples, and look what Christianity became in a couple of centuries.) Also, a deity whose existence can be proved is not a god - it is just another mortal lifeform or natural phenomenon. Further, a deity who is so petty to become insulted of what mere mortals could say about him/her/it is not worth the status of even a demi-god.

Also, "render unto God what belongs to God": any and all attempts to disprove observable facts (such as evolution), to find "scientific" proof for intelligent design and obfuscate the religious agenda behind it, to bring forth any YEC retardness, to enforce one's would-be-religious morals and double standards unto others, to justify why legislation (or censorship, or child protection, or human rights, or public decency) should be based on religion X (as opposed to general humanism), or any other attempts to confuse religion with non-religious matters, all these immediatly provoke me into summoning my good old friends Flying Spaghetti Monster (blessed be His sauce!) and the Invisible Pink Unicorn.

Offline Mspfc Doc DuFresne

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #63 on: 24-04-2010, 01:04:00 »
Arisaka, the fact that you can find only evil when you try to imagine motives for people trying to disprove god is a bit worrying. It is not necessarily for control (not that atheism is terribly useful for controlling people); a lot of, shall we call them aggressive atheists, like Dawkins, genuinely believe that organized religion is responsible for most of the evil that people do to each other, and that rational atheism prevents evil on a mass scale. Looking at the history of organized religion and religious wars, you do have to admit that religious institutions are hardly blameless.

Also, why do you hate people who try and disprove god? Do you hate people who try and convert others to their religion, like door to door preachers? They are a bit annoying, but mostly I feel a bit of pity for them. Certainly no hatred.
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Offline Mr.Deceptive

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #64 on: 24-04-2010, 01:04:54 »
There is no point "hating people who try to disprove god".

It is up to you to prove he exists in the first place.

You can not solidify a fact without evidence. People have been trying for most of human existence, no luck still.
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Offline Kubador

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #65 on: 24-04-2010, 02:04:35 »
I for one envy people who believe. And I mean believers not some malicious, double-standards, posers. I wish there was a god, not even the christian or any known religion kind of god. Just an entity that would make more sense to all of this. Unfortunately I have this gut feeling followed with my reason that there is no such thing. Wonderful thing to have a higher purpose, oh well, gotta occupy myself with something else while I'm here.

Basically I'd like for everyone (believers and non-believers alike) to consider people as individuals and not as labels. This is fundamental for understanding and coexistance. Unluckily conflict is carved into human history and most likely future.

Offline Oddball

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #66 on: 24-04-2010, 06:04:01 »
There is no point "hating people who try to disprove god".

It is up to you to prove he exists in the first place.

You can not solidify a fact without evidence. People have been trying for most of human existence, no luck still.
No, no.. you don't get it, It's NOT up to me, or any other believer to prove to you he exist. This isn't some kind of mathematical debate that can be resolved through facts. There are NO facts proving God exist, i'll say it....and i'll also say that there is NO facts proving he doesn't. Don't even try science. Science is ever changing "facts". What they believe to be true one minute is false the next. It's a bunch of unproven theories, not a hell of a lot better than religion. Therefore either you believe, or you don't. Your too right brained to comprehend anything that is not all facts, therefore you don't believe. Or maybe that is just more BS science pulled from someone's ass.... like most other scientific ideas, hence evolution, global warming, medical studies, etc. You want to find out more information about religion, go talk to a priest, or someone of the sort.

Offline Mr.Deceptive

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #67 on: 24-04-2010, 06:04:38 »
There is no point "hating people who try to disprove god".

It is up to you to prove he exists in the first place.

You can not solidify a fact without evidence. People have been trying for most of human existence, no luck still.
No, no.. you don't get it, It's NOT up to me, or any other believer to prove to you he exist. This isn't some kind of mathematical debate that can be resolved through facts. There are NO facts proving God exist, i'll say it....and i'll also say that there is NO facts proving he doesn't. Don't even try science. Science is ever changing "facts". What they believe to be true one minute is false the next. It's a bunch of unproven theories, not a hell of a lot better than religion. Therefore either you believe, or you don't. Your too right brained to comprehend anything that is not all facts, therefore you don't believe. Or maybe that is just more BS science pulled from someone's ass.... like most other scientific ideas, hence evolution, global warming, medical studies, etc. You want to find out more information about religion, go talk to a priest, or someone of the sort.

So you give no credit to theories then I see?

Electricity is a theory. You are using a computer to post based on theory alone. Congrats.

But yes it does fall to people who present facts to follow up with evidence. Science does this, if they find evidence to probe contrary they disregard their previous thoughts. Science doesn't cling to them hopelessly.

I don't need to find out more about religion. I have read the new and old testament and am currently reading the Quran.

You can't make the argument that people, or myself, doesn't know anything about religion if they have studied it thoroughly and drawn their own conclusions from it.

I was born without religious thought, there is no need to change it. So was everybody else.
« Last Edit: 24-04-2010, 07:04:33 by Mr.Deceptive »
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Offline Zoologic

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #68 on: 24-04-2010, 09:04:03 »
What oddball is pointing at... some aspect of religion (as written in the "book") contains historical fact in perspective of the writer. There are several things that also cannot be proven. And i must say, people who try to prove that part zealously are plain idiots. Same thing for those trying so hard to disprove it. Why go to the extreme? Why be extreme agnostic/atheist/etc? What's the difference with religious fanatic fuckheads then?

This is also true in science. Some of it are true dead-facts. Your computer is working, your airplane is flying, your car is running, your gas cooker is burning well, all science. Though there are some aspects of it that even science can't exactly explain (like two exact copied program run differently in the same compiler, which defies logic).
And transonic shockwave... human can go beyond that (supersonic), yet they still can't explain what happen to the wave in between transonic and supersonic speed, why the supersonic shockwave only occur in some parts of the airplane? It cause aerodynamic buffeting and upset the airframe. Science still can't answer it YET.

When science was proven wrong? When people believe that earth was the centre of the universe. When they say we can go beyond certain speed limit (from 60 km/h, 120 km/h, 200 km/h, mach 1.0, and lastly, the speed of light). In time, it will be all BS, knowing how little all human know about "the truth", got to have some humility in that science is a BIG thing, what human knows, is LITTLE.
Isaac Newton himself is a humble religious person & semi-insane traumatic scientist. Einstein once said, "religion without science is lame, science without religion is blind."

I am trying to be a balanced person here... going to sunday service every week. Reading science journal, observe situation, think rationally, that's all. No extreme belief or disbelief in something.

Offline Thorondor123

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #69 on: 24-04-2010, 10:04:04 »

What does 'theory' mean in science? Let's ask the Oxford English Dictionary.

"Theory: A scheme or system of ideas or statements held as an explanation or account of a group of facts or phenomena; a hypothesis that has been confirmed or established by observation or experiment, and is propounded or accepted as accounting for the known facts; a statement of what are held to be general laws, principles, or causes of something known or observed."

Evolution, gravity, electricity and heliocentric solar system are scientific theories and I would rather like to see you denying the existence of any of those mentioned.

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Offline Lightning

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #70 on: 24-04-2010, 13:04:03 »
Don't even try science. Science is ever changing "facts". What they believe to be true one minute is false the next. It's a bunch of unproven theories, not a hell of a lot better than religion.

How's that not a hell of a lot better?

Offline djinn

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #71 on: 24-04-2010, 13:04:01 »
Arguing science versus religion is like trying to make peace in the West bank... they don't sprechnzie the same language

A Theist who values religion over science will never agree that science is accurate otherwise he would see a flaw in his faith and an Atheist who values Sciece over faith can't see faith as fair otherwise, he too will have contradictions.

And you can't use one side's argument to disprove the other. just as you can't use the Bible to disprove scientific method as Truth, you cannot use the scientific method to disprove the Bible as Truth... although on a side note, I believe the latter is load of medieval horse dump that has somehow caused a chain reaction lasting longer than the creators expected it to... like the CIA and AIDS, if you buy into that urban legend

I think we need to focus strictly on Belief in God and not try to compare the two schools of thought in their totality.. that road leads to madness, friend.

Offline GoldFingero

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #72 on: 24-04-2010, 13:04:48 »
I am not religious. But I am tired of those fanatic ateists. Religion is not about hate or fear, its about finding strength in something, have something that keeps you alive.
Cowards way out? Maybe.

I dont care what others belive, as long they are not trying to convert me or saying bad things about other peoples religion. And, tedacious, that nietzche quote you have sounds like a racist is talking about blacks. Maybe I am wrong but it sounds like he is saying: Religious people should not have the same rights as ateists.

Religion dont start wars, money, land and power does, religion is an excuse.

Offline Miklas

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #73 on: 24-04-2010, 14:04:08 »
Sure you can't disprove the exsistence of a god but there are several people who managed to prove that the existence of an omnipotent and loving god is impossible (Epicurean paradox, the unliftable stone, etc). So I think that believing in a powerless and/or loveless god is not fruitful, just a waste of time.

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Re: Proof god exists
« Reply #74 on: 24-04-2010, 14:04:25 »
Humans spent far too much time defending points of view

We are here for an incredibly short time and spending any of it defending either side is pointless. Actually, 'defending your point of view' is right up there with 'worry' and 'regret' as all-time biggest wasters of what time we have. None of these things will accomplish anything.

I have a fairly strong opinion about this topic, but what would I hope to accomplish? What does it matter? We all find out soon enough.