Author Topic: Revolting Uniting  (Read 305168 times)

Offline LHeureux

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #675 on: 22-05-2012, 00:05:13 »
Also tons of students had their Iphones and Macs WAAAAY before the total announcement of the raise in fees.
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Offline THeTA0123

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #676 on: 22-05-2012, 00:05:20 »
Try and pay for one semester in Ontario or in BC and every single Quebec student would shut the fuck up for eternity (6000 Dollars for one semester @ UBC makes McGill look like a dollar store). These protests are symptomatic of a much larger problem within Quebec and that is simply the fact that your expectations are no longer grounded in a fiscal reality. Quebecker's bitch about reasonable accomodation, yet they won't even act rationally or even pretend towards fiscal responsibility.
Any higher education (in Finland) costs me the books required + nothing else (minus living expenses payed by the government), yet it is one of the least in-debt countries in the EU + best educated + in the top 10 in freedom of press in the world.




Well educated citizens = prosperity.
Yep. Take belgium
Our country is theoretical not rich
But our citizens are amongst the richest of europe.
Mostly thanks to our very good universities.
-i am fairly sure that if they took porn off the internet, there would only be one website left and it would be called bring back the porn "Perry cox, Scrubs.

Offline sheikyerbouti

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #677 on: 22-05-2012, 01:05:33 »
 @ L'heureux,

 I don't own a corporation but I do have over 10 thousand in debt from only 2 years of college. I had to drop out because I cannot afford the tuition but i do plan on moving back to Quebec to take advantage of the low cost education. You get what you pay for and Quebec has not been paying their bills for a very long time. Blame our parents  for taking advantage of the system.


 I completely agree with free/low cost education but only if it repays the social obligation for receiving such generous support in the first place. In Quebec, there is an expectation of social service without being responsible for those very costs. these costs are now so extreme that some one will have to pay the bills and guess what, there's no money left. (this is diametrically opposite to the European social system which expects reciprocity, through national service or through forms of higher taxation)

p.s. bullshit red herring about China miners in Quebec. None of you Pure Laine want to leave Montreal to go work for a living and with a Conservative government you will not get any money from the rest of Canada for being lazy.

 There is a reason why the economic power in Canada lies in the West.  Go ahead and blame Jean Charest and the Liberal's if you want but Pauline Marois, Rene Levesque or Robert Bourassa would have made the same decision.

 Quebec is killing itself by enabling a sense of entitlement that far exceeds their means and their will to repay the social dividend.

 Dialogue will result in success, not by terrorist bombings of the Metro or burning cars and ransacking hard working business ventures. Protest in the legitimate forms is always welcome and in fact, reflects very well upon a civil society but in the case of Quebec's student protests, these protests are disrupting daily life and economic activity far in excess of any benefit you will receive in the future.

 After all is said and done, you will still have the lowest schooling costs in North America but still the Quebec sense is to keep bitching about it and not actually provide any rational decisions that will ameliorate the situation.


 Like i said earlier, you do not have the sympathy of those of us that have truly been burdened with outrageous school costs. Walk a mile in our shoes and you will soon recant your outrage.

My Quebec includes Canada

Offline THeTA0123

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #678 on: 22-05-2012, 01:05:25 »


*Smacks table
OK what is this all aboot
« Last Edit: 22-05-2012, 01:05:32 by THeTA0123 »
-i am fairly sure that if they took porn off the internet, there would only be one website left and it would be called bring back the porn "Perry cox, Scrubs.

Offline sheikyerbouti

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #679 on: 22-05-2012, 01:05:31 »
 It's class warfare Theta,
 working class versus welfare.


 McGill university arts degree, main campus Montreal = $2492.70
 annual estimated cost of living $11 000    (but can be much cheaper)
 ~ $13 492.70 per annum
source: www.mcgill.ca

 University of British Columbia arts degree, main campus Vancouver = $4700.40
 annual estimated cost of living $16 763  (reasonable estimate IMO but does not include additional student association fees and book costs) 
~ $ 21 463 per annum
source: www.grad.ubc.ca

 In real terms of cost comparison, Quebec student's are afforded a tremendous advantage. The math doesn't lie, it's just too bad that quebecker's won't pull out their calculator's. The imbalance grows stronger when comparison is made to advanced degree's such as medicine or engineering.
My Quebec includes Canada

Offline LHeureux

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #680 on: 22-05-2012, 05:05:16 »
I agree with you but it's sad that you see the criminals as the majority, you can't control everything, students want and always wanted peacefull protests but there's always assholes that breaking bank windows and make some smoke in a metro. In 100 days of protests there was less fire and shit than in 1 night in Vancouver when their hockey team lost.
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Offline sheikyerbouti

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #681 on: 22-05-2012, 05:05:03 »
 Actually,
 you don't know what you are talking about, so let's stay relevant and on topic. The last hockey riot in Montreal was way bigger than what happened last year in downtown Vancouver.


 The cost of everything is rising, yet FECQ and the other groups are opposing a very small increase in order to recoup the losses that the Quebec education system creates on a long term basis. This problem started in the early 1980's and successive Que. government's have been too afraid to actually confront the problem.

 my post above is actually under-representative of true costs as Quebec student's enjoy major benefits that are not equalled anywhere else in North America. The protests in Montreal lost all legitimacy the minute that the Radical groups were allowed to participate as equal partner's.

p.s. : it was an act of terrorism to smoke bomb the Metro,
"do you honestly believe that incident was not terrifying to the innocent passenger's who were unaware of the true motivations of the actors involved?"

 Kudos to Charest for displaying the balls that Quebecker's usually tuck inside...
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Offline Paasky

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #682 on: 22-05-2012, 05:05:50 »
The problem in Quebec resides mostly with the fact that this "higher education" is not actually resulting in any long term benefit to the Quebec economy (let alone that of Canada). Quebec's GDP is dropping, wages are decreasing and student's are not applying their studies to relevant fields of employment. (eg: pursuit of degree's for personal satisfaction like getting a master's in poetry so you can work in a coffee shop)
This is why you have the government telling schools how many people can start studying x subject each year. Like in the past 10 years, the allowed starting places for metal & wood industry-related studies have been cut while nursing & IT have been allowed to increase. Sure it lags behind by 3-5 years, and they still allow too many humanist subjects with very little real employment possibilities, but the majority will study something that is useful for both themselves & society as a whole.


FYI increasing tuition costs may seem like a quick way to spend less on education, but it very quickly increases the difficulty of "social class movement", aka someone coming from a poor family will have an even more difficult time trying to climb the social (income) ladder. This idea was pushed through by the socialists here in the 50's & 60's and has been such a huge success (we were one of the poorest & technologically backwards nations in Europe up to the early 50's) that any suggestion to have people actually pay for higher education is immediately shot down.
« Last Edit: 22-05-2012, 05:05:14 by Paasky »
It's half naked people on boats. That's all.
Here in Finland we call that "summer".

Offline sheikyerbouti

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #683 on: 22-05-2012, 06:05:20 »
 I am incredibly familiar and quite jealous of the advantage imposed by Euro government's when it comes to schooling but that situation does not relate well to the issues faced by student's in North America. (of attention is the fact that your country and many other European nations demand national service in order to compensate for your demands of social equity. Additionally, European social standards impose limits on wages, hours of employment and sundry other details that are not reflected by our Laissez-faire, free market based system). eg: A doctor in Finland is probably not allowed to refuse patients, yet that is the norm across Canada (if you can even find one).

 Essentially, our system is dictated by student demands, not by nationally/ provincially imposed enrolment. Our government's let personal choice prevail over common sense decisions, hence the result that we have PHD's working for minimum wages in fields that are totally unrelated to their studies. By continuing an ongoing direct government subsidy, there is little chance for the reform's needed to make the system both affordable to the taxpayer and valuable to the student body as well as the economy at large. (how is this fair to future generations? let alone honest to ourselves?)

 As a spin off result, employer expectations are far exceeding the actual demands of various positions. (I don't need a degree to answer phones but that has become the norm here in vancouver, as well as across Canada). Another unfortunate result from this governmental position is that core areas of employment demand cannot be accomodated by the current curriculum.

 In terms of Canada, core employment needs reside in Healthcare, Engineering, and Resource extraction, yet the student bodies are demanding to be educated in frivolous subjects like poetry and classic studies that do not return benefit to the economy, distract precious teachers from vital areas of education, and create an imbalanced situation whereby the rich can truly take advantage by using their wealth to monopolize the limited classes that are both lucrative and limited in availability.

 So what does our government end up doing? they recruit from foreign nations and encourage their establishment in Canada as either part of the social elite or as an absolute social underclass. What is truly needed in Canada is a national dialogue with a mindset towards a permanent remedy that values the taxpayer, either as a janitor or as an engineer.

 The status quo is corrupt, it is incumbent upon our generation to make the necessary and relevant change. Otherwise we are dooming ourselves to failure...
My Quebec includes Canada

Offline DLFReporter

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #684 on: 22-05-2012, 08:05:46 »
Uuuh a nice theme. And I fully agree on that sheik:
Quote
The status quo is corrupt, it is incumbent upon our generation to make the necessary and relevant change. Otherwise we are dooming ourselves to failure...


To put up something more to flame a long shitstorm: Strict Gun-laws they might just work.

Quote
According to Germany's Der Spiegel, German police shot only 85 bullets in all of 2011, a stark reminder that not every country is as gun-crazy as the U.S. of A. As Boing Boing translates, most of those shots weren't even aimed people: "49 warning shots, 36 shots on suspects. 15 persons were injured, 6 were killed."

http://news.yahoo.com/german-police-used-only-85-bullets-against-people-155155175.html

Edit: I know neither site is a good source for news... ^^
« Last Edit: 22-05-2012, 08:05:15 by DLFReporter »
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Offline sheikyerbouti

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #685 on: 22-05-2012, 09:05:18 »
 Those 49 warning shots should have been used by a firing squad on those Neo-nazi's that were killing immigrants last year.


 Remember guns don't pull their own triggers,
My Quebec includes Canada

Offline DLFReporter

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #686 on: 22-05-2012, 09:05:17 »
Nope sorry, no capital punishment in a civilized country. You as a Canadian know that as well.  ;D
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Offline sheikyerbouti

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #687 on: 22-05-2012, 09:05:06 »
 IMO there should be capital punishment. Some people like Breivik don't deserve the opportunity to burden us for the rest of their lives.

 bring back the gallows... or the firing squad, I will personally volunteer.
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Offline Thorondor123

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #688 on: 22-05-2012, 11:05:51 »
"Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends"
Let mortal heroes sing your fame

Offline THeTA0123

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Re: Revolting Uniting
« Reply #689 on: 22-05-2012, 13:05:32 »
Life is unfair, get over it.

In belgium, people where given funds to place solar panels, in wich in 5 years, you would have earned back your investment and you would recieve 330 euro per 3 months for delivering electric power to the net. On average

Then count away your electricity bill


Now thousands of families and cooperations did this.

Now they reduced these funds, the entire solar market in belgium collapsed, and anyone who does NOT HAVE SOLAR PANELS HAS TO PAY 20-40% MORE ON THERE ELECTRICITY bill


In other words, I have to pay for my neighbours there solar panels. While they earn tonnes of money

Fair? No. Can we do anything about it? no. Thats life
Life sucks
-i am fairly sure that if they took porn off the internet, there would only be one website left and it would be called bring back the porn "Perry cox, Scrubs.