Forgotten Hope Public Forum
Forgotten Hope 2 => Normandy maps => Feedback => Ramelle => Topic started by: Toddel on 01-10-2010, 23:10:24
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"If you have a suggestions or want to give us some Feedback about this Map you can Post it here!"
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(Cut it out of the thread in general discussion)
Some players were complaining about the old "it's fiction"... but the grand majority was just overwhelmed. It's so far THE masterpiece. The gameplay was fun as one could decide what kind of action he is seeking. I appreciate that very much. The battles against the tigers are epic.. and as well the allied counterattacks when they shell the city with the mortars and rush in with the bazookas and the shermans.
The details are too many to realize within 1.5 hours. But I saw so many details that I was really more than happy. Wow! It really gives FH2 a map that was needed!
Bugs(?): I'm not sure whether it's a bug. I told it Otolikos ingame but I didn't understand he's answer. :-)
- some of the players didn't see the flag caping sign
- I had the problem with the "alamo" flag. The sign appeared right when I neutralized it. I saw it afterwards and when we had the flag. But playing on the german side the flag zone was not visible unless I stand around and obviously neutralized it.
- Names of flags: dummy name? Is this intentionally?
Ramelle I love you! This is a really something that FH2 was lacking before! I believe once the players know the ways through the city it will be even better. Some houses are so cool to hide / snipe / wait with bazooka... that I can't wait for it. Really god job!
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It's a matter of taste.... Ramelle plays very linearly, you have "attack lanes" and "choke points" and "fire zones". The tactics are totally different as opposed to an "open" map, even when compared to other infantry maps, so it takes some time getting used to. Also, the fact that spawn zones are much farther away from the flags than ever before is something that requires moar playtime before it can be commented upon. However, the nice and well laid-out ruins alone would make the map fun to fight... if I hadn't a personal grudge. :P
Something of note, many players complained about lag/low fps, although I couldn't detect any and my FPS was always more than my screen refresh rate (but with my new rig, that was kind of expected).
Something that might or might not be improved is that the air strike does not arrive exactly when the bridge falls, but at seemingly random moment after that, so the dramatic effect it could have is pretty much wasted.
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One of the Allied spawnpoints is very inconviniently placed.
Scenario: Germans have captured the entire town including the south 'Crossroads' flag. Americans only have their HQ and the eastern city 'Clearing' flags. Now, (one of ? ) the spawnpoints of this 'Clearing' flag is far east of the city, in the middle of a field full of advancing Germans.
Problem: you will get killed every time you spawn there.
Here's the map to make it all clear.
(http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/3655/screen004u.png) (http://img718.imageshack.us/i/screen004u.png/)
Solution: this spawnpoint should either be removed, moved northward, or be disabled once the Germans capture the southern flag.
As for the rest: really awesome map. I'm glad you guys finaly decided a bit of fiction is fun aswell. I've had a great time on this map so far playing Sherman, Tiger and bazooka spammer. It is a bit CoD style as mentioned above, but it's just something to get used to. By far the best map of 2.3 imo.
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I suspect that spawn point is supposed to be german only but was overlooked during coding.
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thx guys for your comments and feedback :)
First, if the planes spawn instantly after the bridge is taken, there will be no more surprise 2 weeks after 2.3 release.You will see germans taking the flag and run around to take cover.
Maybe some of you will have low fps on the map. I've tried to do my best to prevent that when mapping but by nature, urban maps are laggiest than open maps.
About the spawnpoint, maybe the better solution is to remove this one. Never noticed on betatest sessions:/ Maybe due to Clearing flag was often lost before crossroad flag.
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Great map, but I noticed a bit of lag online (haven't played SP yet). Wolfgaming's server was a little unstable the last couple of nights, so that could be the problem. My guess is that it would be worse for me (East Coast U.S.) to try it on Hslan or 762 or whatever Euro server is running.
I shouldn't, in theory, lag: Phenom II 1055T CPU, 4 GB DDR3 1600 RAM, and ATI 5670 Radeon GPU.
Overall, the map plays really well. I've been on two German teams now, both of which won the map. I've yet to see the Amis use the mortars, which might help their cause.
I have a feeling a large amount of playtesting went on to balance the map. I'm curious as to why the German's kits are mostly limited. I'm not complaining (it adds a good wrinkle, IMHO), but interested in how the betatesters came up with that suggestion.
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Scout is limited cause it has the G43, engineer is limited so the explosives don't get spammed.
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Plenty of times where I could have used a grenade but found I didn't have one!
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An ammo kit at "US reinforcements" for the mortar.
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An ammo kit at "US reinforcements" for the mortar.
Omg
Let to Germans a chance to cross the bridge ;) planes + unlimited mortars :o
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An ammo kit at "US reinforcements" for the mortar.
Omg
Let to Germans a chance to cross the bridge ;) planes + unlimited mortars :o
you gotta be goddam kidding me right? is 2 tigers and 2 marders at the BEGIN off the map not enough FFS?
7 times did i played ramelle now, all ended in massive german Killwhorefests
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Well on atleast two occations while playing as Allied, we managed to push the germans back from the bridge to the first flag and destroy their tigers, thus winning the battle.
At first it seems as if it would be impossible but really it isnt, it just requires some teamwork, wich has been lacking abit since there are alot of newcomers playing at the moment.
My early impression of this map is that it is very well done and nicely balanced. Sure i have only been playing it for two days, but I do like it alot!
The bridge is where the battle is won or lost really, just like the old FH42 Ramelle map. That's what I like most about this map. Really captures the essence that made the old one great.
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Jesus can't wait to play it.. Damn internetproviders!
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lol @ tanks.. 88 kills, 157, 200 kills etc.. not only from me... havn´t decided if it´s fun or not but it seems wrong.
It´s been like that every time I played that map. But it´s a nice map, maby even better without tanks?
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Yesterday i played 3 times on ramelle and Axis team didn't reach the fountain or right flank flag.
Even with 2 tigers and 2 marders.
Some of tiger drivers just care about their frag and not for flag.What can i don against that? Nothing imo.
Maybe teamplay and public server are not friendly........
Seriously, it really depends on the quality of team.
If axis team has a great teamplay, they can kick Allies ass out of bridge quickly.
If Allies team has a great teamplay, they can stop Axis at town entrance.
IF both team have a great teamplay, i only see that on the first day release (strange, in first day seems the teamplay was at his top:/) Germans can take bridge and alamo, tanks are available for Allies and kick axis back to fountain, and Axis try to retake all the previous positions.
The key on this map, (it should be on all maps but not really seen) is TEAMPLAY. ;)
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The allied reinforcements are useless, and the P51 didn't even show up when I played Ramelle. The Germans captured the bridge flag, and the Tiger proceeded to cross the bridge.
Nope, no P51 showed up to save the day. All we had left was one useless 75mm Sherman.
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perhaps spawning the 76mm sherman earlier would help?
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The allied reinforcements are useless, and the P51 didn't even show up when I played Ramelle. The Germans captured the bridge flag, and the Tiger proceeded to cross the bridge.
Nope, no P51 showed up to save the day. All we had left was one useless 75mm Sherman.
And this is the scenario that happens the most. The problem is, most tiger drivers just sit back, and spam HE. And the gaint killwhore fest begins. it is so high, it even stays ahead the ticket bleed of the germans.
Seriously, its suppose to be a higher loss rate among the attackers, but this defiantly NOT the case.
People say "I saw allies win once " and this but thats only once. The general public does NOT know how to cooperate properly.
Trow a tiger out. Because even when the tigers are down, by the time the allies could advanced a bit, the tiger is back. Remeber the germans have good equipment to defend against a counterattack aswel (MG42)
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Once I try to find at-mine kit on the field, but it seems mappers find best to not place it on the map. The long bridge needs so badly at-mines. When tigers roll over the bridge whole way to behind lines its soon gg. Sherman hvap could save the day if it spawn right after when river side flag is lost. Now tiger have enough time to drive camp out sherman. 2 tigers without any strong anti-tank tool around is the thing what bugs me. I quess at-mines was not so rarely used by US army that hirtorical accuracy would not be ruined if we had those.
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@ two Tigers: kill one and it won't respawn. So then there is only 1 Tiger. But of course that is SUPAH DUPAH IMBA AXIS BIASED!!! right, Theta?
@ no P51s: they don't appear immediately. It takes a short while. Unless you have been sitting at the bridge for the entire remaining patrt of the round and didn't see any P51s, I'd say you missed them. If you didn't please report it as a bug.
@ AT mines: with mines this map becomes unplayable. There is a reason AT mines aren't in Normandy except for ome pu-kits, like in Cagny (whic is on the very spacious map Goodwood).
For people who cry at German power in this map:
- This is a fictional scenario from a movie and the map sticks close to it. Be glad it didn't stick to it totally, because then there weren't even Shermans to counterattack with.
- The map has been won by US a few times already. They will get better at it. Yesterday there was a round of Ramelle in which the axis only got 1 flag (Ruins) in total and lost the round.
- Like has been said before: "Give it a few weeks then come back and post your feedback again"
(note the word "feedback", which means something totally different from whining about losing the map all the time)
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@ two Tigers: kill one and it won't respawn. So then there is only 1 Tiger. But of course that is SUPAH DUPAH IMBA AXIS BIASED!!! right, Theta?
@ no P51s: they don't appear immediately. It takes a short while. Unless you have been sitting at the bridge for the entire remaining patrt of the round and didn't see any P51s, I'd say you missed them. If you didn't please report it as a bug.
@ AT mines: with mines this map becomes unplayable. There is a reason AT mines aren't in Normandy except for ome pu-kits, like in Cagny (whic is on the very spacious map Goodwood).
For people who cry at German power in this map:
- This is a fictional scenario from a movie and the map sticks close to it. Be glad it didn't stick to it totally, because then there weren't even Shermans to counterattack with.
- The map has been won by US a few times already. They will get better at it. Yesterday there was a round of Ramelle in which the axis only got 1 flag (Ruins) in total and lost the round.
- Like has been said before: "Give it a few weeks then come back and post your feedback again"
(note the word "feedback", which means something totally different from whining about losing the map all the time)
Actually in the film shermans roll up just after the bridge is blown...
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Actually in the film shermans roll up just after the bridge is blown...
I haven't the same movie, cause the bridge is never blown in my version ;)
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@ two Tigers: kill one and it won't respawn. So then there is only 1 Tiger. But of course that is SUPAH DUPAH IMBA AXIS BIASED!!! right, Theta?
Now listen here moron, Did i ever said Axis bias? Is suggesting things these days always result in this kind of bullcrap? Theirs actually pretty enough people who agree with this, because the Tiger HE spamming all around is just a gaint fucking killwhorefest.
Their where infact never 2 tigers on Ramelle. So their.
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There =/= Their
Where =/= Were
And there were two Tigers in the film :O
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Now listen here moron,
??????? >:(
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There =/= Their
Where =/= Were
And there were two Tigers in the film :O
(Flippy is on vacation?)
People keep saying it was a PZIV :oNow listen here moron,
??????? >:(
Had it with the bullcrap. Its also the same on WOT Forums, the moment you say something bad about german tanks( aka telling the truth that the tiger tank is no match for an IS3 wich it shouldnt) you get -1 rep
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Considering the general public isn't the most cooperative when it comes to teamwork, something has to be done about the balance in this map. I've played about 6 times now, and every single time the axis has won. Remember guys, while the map is supposed to be true to the movie, you can't forget about the fun factor. It's no fun when you just had a great match on St. Lo and then you see the Ramelle loading screen and you're like "damn, time for us to get our asses handed to us".
I think this map could really benefit from removing one of the tigers and one of the marders. Having 2 pieces of armor has GOT to be enough to face off against a bunch of infantry. At least this way we can have a chance of bazooka-ing a tiger without getting shot by the other.
The general design of the map is god damn beautiful and I hate to see it go to waste because of an unfair balance.
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Maybe put a Churchill on the map?
;D
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Ramelle was made for the germans win easily.
Two Tigers,one Marder,ultra limited bazookas and even suicide kits,and no tanks for allied till the germans are on the last flag.And bazooka don´t even tickle the Tiger.
This map is ultra lame,even a group of 4 chimps with cerebral palsy can hold 32 allied soldiers.
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Ramelle was made for the germans win easily.
Two Tigers,one Marder,ultra limited bazookas and even suicide kits,and no tanks for allied till the germans are on the last flag.And bazooka don´t even tickle the Tiger.
This map is ultra lame,even a group of 4 chimps with cerebral palsy can hold 32 allied soldiers.
Well.. Somewhat you are right. Because it is very difficult to dent those tigers. First of all they are swarming with infantery, making attacking them in the rear very difficult. You also have 2 rockets, and you need like 4-5 of them to kill a tiger from the sides/rear.
The only effective weapon the allies have, is a mortar, but with no ammo kit, it becomes completly useless
The map issent lame, it is infact very nice, but it needs some buffing up on the allied part.
Dont come with a stupid meme, because if you look at the whole picture, you see the allies are underpowerd on this map
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I wonder why I see them win when they are underpowered?
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Ramelle was made for the germans win easily.
Two Tigers,one Marder,ultra limited bazookas and even suicide kits,and no tanks for allied till the germans are on the last flag.And bazooka don´t even tickle the Tiger.
This map is ultra lame,even a group of 4 chimps with cerebral palsy can hold 32 allied soldiers.
Hmmm, you're lucky, since 3 days, everytime i played ramelle, axis team didn't reach fountain or rightflank flags.SOme players on servers asking me to remove nades and some bazooka kits for allies to let tanks to go into city......
1 day i read, hey the map is allied bias: it's an ally campfest map
and the next day: hey this map is axis biased! 2 Tigers are too powerful.... remove one please!
I repeat again, the team who plays as a Real team has a great chance to win...But i should admit that lazy players will always play as Allies ;)
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I wonder why I see them win when they are underpowered?
Tbh i dont think the winning part is that important for the people who dislike this map, its the kill ratio, Germans, as ive experienced had atleast 100 kills more than Americans. (played 3x)
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So it's a stat-whore thing?
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So it's a stat-whore thing?
Well i do not care about having a death or two more than kills but after a while it is just so pissing not having a single kill in fex 10 respawns...
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I saw already more than once that the allied could stop the germans. It is a sometimes tough, but all depends on the team - as Otolikos said. I don't believe that something should be changed (except maybe for the spawnpoint as discussed on page 1.)
Let's wait a few weeks and it will be clearer.
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I saw some rounds were allies won easily due to overly cautious/ camping tigers who didn't move up with the infantry.
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Now listen here moron,
Yes, nice. If you don't know how to react, resort to calling names. That's gonna help for sure ::)
Did i ever said Axis bias?
Yes, like a gazillion times.
Is suggesting things these days always result in this kind of bullcrap?
No. Sometimes you suggest things of which I think they are really nice. Some of them I actually support. But you often aren't suggesting, but whining about imbalance (and that is usually in favour of the Germans if one should believe you).
Theirs actually pretty enough people who agree with this, because the Tiger HE spamming all around is just a gaint fucking killwhorefest.
Yes, and there are also enough other people who disagree.
Their where infact never 2 tigers on Ramelle. So their.
This one has been answered already.
Had it with the bullcrap.
Did you ever consider that other people maybe might have had it with your posts? You give a nice example yourself when you mention other gaming forums outside of this one.
I posted that because I was fed up to read yet ANOTHER "omg, this is so unfair to the allies" post. You have been playing this game for long enough to know that a map needs time, so why not give it a rest until it has been played or some weeks?
I'll give this a rest now.
@ "it is hard to kill the Tiger": yes, it is hard. And therefore it is that much more rewarding if you kill one. Even better: when you kill one, it won't respawn! So then you only have to deal with 50% of the Tiger force for the rest of the round. A little later you will get Shermans, one of which is 76mm.
@ "no tanks for allied till the germans are on the last flag": ehm, no. The tanks spawn earlier than that, maybe too late in your opinion, and that is something which can be discussed of course, but if the tanks really spawned when the Germans were on the last flag, what use would they have?
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Just had a great round on this. fun house to house squad fighting that you dont see in the other maps. The long straight street design and clear view makes it interesting and different. Only thing that is hard for me is the massive kit limiting. I cant use rifles with my ping and it's tough to get anything else.
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Now listen here moron,
Yes, nice. If you don't know how to react, resort to calling names. That's gonna help for sure ::)
Did i ever said Axis bias?
Yes, like a gazillion times.
Go ahead Find one after 2.2 that wassent part of the FH2 meme.
Because everyone here knows that the "axis bias" meme was only truly ment in one topic(stupidly yes by me. But you have to wider your view wich i did, and if i was like that, i would have voted germans are OP allies are UP in "The state of balance thread" right? well i dint)
And was later carried out as a tradition.
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No,it´s more like a Hollywood banzai charging issue.You spawn next to Tiger.Get out of cover running and arming the B composite,Tiger kills you.
In FH1 Ramelle was perfect.Apparently,germans could win without effort,but americans could hold them without difficulty using bazookas,ex packs,mines...
And what is "the FH2 meme"?Limiting AT kits?That was the most sad and stupid decision the team could have.
3 guys with AT on server,1 work and the other 2 waste the AT.And that´s not about that tanks BS,aka,"the tanks should combat the other tanks".
To get thing less interesting,in Ramelle even the suicide class is limited.
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I think Otolikos pretty much sum it up.
The most "fair" players ever is bots. They have equal skills and team organization. So this happens in coop server.
Players <40: The map will be easily won by the Germans, because of their armour superiority and apparently lack of defenders swarming the incoming Germans. The Americans couldn't really recap the bridge back, because the Sherman driver is either too weak (even by human players), the German Tiger is bots and they are good enough fending off attackers back.
Players >40: The Germans will not advance beyond the Ruins flag. This is due to several suicide attacks and Bazooka rockets. When the Tiger turned right to the fountain, they are immediately greeted with boom booms. The German infantry couldn't just throw their grenades right to kill those Americans hidden well within the ruins. IMO, the suicide kit and he Zooks should really be limited in Ramelle, the bots here use 4-5 bazookas, 3-5 suicide kits, and that's enough to stop even moderately skilled human tankers.
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Ramelle was made for the germans win easily.
Two Tigers,one Marder,ultra limited bazookas and even suicide kits,and no tanks for allied till the germans are on the last flag.And bazooka don´t even tickle the Tiger.
This map is ultra lame,even a group of 4 chimps with cerebral palsy can hold 32 allied soldiers.
Well.. Somewhat you are right. Because it is very difficult to dent those tigers. First of all they are swarming with infantery, making attacking them in the rear very difficult. You also have 2 rockets, and you need like 4-5 of them to kill a tiger from the sides/rear.
The only effective weapon the allies have, is a mortar, but with no ammo kit, it becomes completly useless
The map issent lame, it is infact very nice, but it needs some buffing up on the allied part.
Dont come with a stupid meme, because if you look at the whole picture, you see the allies are underpowerd on this map
I´ve noticed that in this map there are some narrow spots, where the tiger, because of it size and the poor driver visibility, can be easily stopped with a few smoke grenades. For example, in the main road between the fountain and the bridge, you have to pass between a wrecked pzIV and a wardrobe. That place is a deathtrap and a perfect ambush site. Also in the road that goes to Church road flag, near the corner with the South-Nord Road were the german begin their attack.
If the allied find ways to stop (not necessarily destroy) the tigers before they get close to the bridge flag, the german advance can be halted. Once the bridge is lost, until the shermans start to spawn, you are right that there is almost no hope for the americans
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And what is "the FH2 meme"?Limiting AT kits?That was the most sad and stupid decision the team could have.
3 guys with AT on server,1 work and the other 2 waste the AT.And that´s not about that tanks BS,aka,"the tanks should combat the other tanks".
To get thing less interesting,in Ramelle even the suicide class is limited.
You have maybe only 3 at kits as spawn classes but you have some (at each flag) AT drop kits.Maybe you haven't find them yet. The advantage of drop kits is every player can try to destroy tanks.If AT dropkits has been removed and replaced by 6 AT spawn classes, you could have 5 waste of AT.....And for who complains about only 2 rockets by AT, you can find ammobox in the map (Total of 7....)
AT class is the most challenging class in the map IMO. Hide/fire/run away cause you have been spotted/hide again/reload/hide in another place and Fire again!
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The Kitlimits aren't the problem, just give the people the time to learn a map. As always it will play totally different once some time has passed and people learn their preferred strategies.
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As long as an ammo kit gets placed in the map, i am satisfied
The best would be US reinforcements
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As long as an ammo kit gets placed in the map, i am satisfied
There are 7 on the map atm according to the maker. ;)
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Map looks awesome, not gonna comment on balance yet but it looks incredible and a great job on the recreation
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As long as an ammo kit gets placed in the map, i am satisfied
There are 7 on the map atm according to the maker. ;)
Say what again!
you gotta be!
AAGH
Where does he hide them? under the bridge? On the ROOSTER on top of the CHURCH?
THE HUNT IS ON!
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As long as an ammo kit gets placed in the map, i am satisfied
There are 7 on the map atm according to the maker. ;)
Say what again!
you gotta be!
AAGH
Where does he hide them? under the bridge? On the ROOSTER on top of the CHURCH?
THE HUNT IS ON!
I´m right behind you, not seen any yet :-)
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This is what Otolikos said:
You have maybe only 3 at kits as spawn classes but you have some (at each flag) AT drop kits.Maybe you haven't find them yet. The advantage of drop kits is every player can try to destroy tanks.If AT dropkits has been removed and replaced by 6 AT spawn classes, you could have 5 waste of AT.....And for who complains about only 2 rockets by AT, you can find ammobox in the map (Total of 7....)
I have seen one box for example under the arcades at the house with the petrol bomb on the left of the bridge (Axis pov) and one in the church afaik.
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ammobox != ammo kit if you are manning the mortar
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This is what Otolikos said:
You have maybe only 3 at kits as spawn classes but you have some (at each flag) AT drop kits.Maybe you haven't find them yet. The advantage of drop kits is every player can try to destroy tanks.If AT dropkits has been removed and replaced by 6 AT spawn classes, you could have 5 waste of AT.....And for who complains about only 2 rockets by AT, you can find ammobox in the map (Total of 7....)
I have seen one box for example under the arcades at the house with the petrol bomb on the left of the bridge (Axis pov) and one in the church afaik.
Those are AT pickup kits and ammo boxes (static)
we need Ammo kits :)
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I've placed "7" Ammo boxes not ammo kits....... Mortar has only 39 rockets, after that there is no more rockets. unlimited ammo for mortar will be hell for axis team.....every time i play this map, axis team can't reach the bridge.....:/
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I've placed "7" Ammo boxes not ammo kits....... Mortar has only 39 rockets, after that there is no more rockets. unlimited ammo for mortar will be hell for axis team.....every time i play this map, axis team can't reach the bridge.....:/
If you place an ammo kit, it will only give an additional 15 mortar shells or so. Reloading "ammo boxes" takes a HELLOVA long time.
OR
you can give the mortar 15 or 20 rounds. You place an ammo kit at US reinforcements. When the ammo is depleted, it takes a very long time to get new ammo
This also prevents the US from spamming 39 mortar shells when the germans try to cross the bridge (since mortar spawns after bridge is captured)
Because ATM, i now need to get one spot, make it that the shells land on the middle of the bridge, then i can just relax back and watch getting 50+ kills
Whatcha think?
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you can give the mortar 15 or 20 rounds. You place an ammo kit at US reinforcements. When the ammo is depleted, it takes a very long time to get new ammo
Here, a decent suggestion. +1 Important is that the nearest ammobox is far away, so the ammokit cannot be replenished with more ammo for a while.
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you can give the mortar 15 or 20 rounds. You place an ammo kit at US reinforcements. When the ammo is depleted, it takes a very long time to get new ammo
Here, a decent suggestion. +1 Important is that the nearest ammobox is far away, so the ammokit cannot be replenished with more ammo for a while.
love that ;D
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so germans get 2 whoring tigers and marders but allies cannot get a simple ammo box? pff
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so germans get 2 whoring tigers and marders but allies cannot get a simple ammo box? pff
Sean Connery's voice:
Shtop whining.
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The map is awesome! ;D It is very well made and has a lot of detail. I really like the 30 Cal in the tower or the 30 Cal to set up and then use the "Look on top of your gun" view, then when the germans coming in from the main street and are in your sight you start open fire at them and its like your in SPR!
Some nice additions:
- AI using the right flank aswell, right now the main road is only used by the Germans.
- Add a static 30 Caliber MG in the wallhole like in SPR, so when they are coming from the right (if the use the right flank, like I mentoined) you can hold them up like in SPR.
- Let the AI make use of the 22mm Flak gun, it seems they dont use it at all.
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so germans get 2 whoring tigers and marders but allies cannot get a simple ammo box? pff
Hey, the fact that I now visually approved of one of your suggestions doesn't mean you can go down "that" road again, geez. ::)
If the ammobox is too close, the whole idea behind your suggestion will become obsolete because the guy with the ammokit will just run for 10 seconds and replenish his ammoboxes in the kit, providing overpoweredness to the mortar.
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Similar to my comments on Brest 64 (http://fhpubforum.warumdarum.de/index.php?topic=11750.15) St Lo provides intense urban combat, another variety on the FH2 spice rack. Not quite as DoD: Source styled as Brest, but with a similar team deathmatch feel.
As with Brest, I'm not entirely sure about this type of map in FH2 other than as an occasional variety piece, as its not really what I play the mod for.
However this map can also suffer an epic fail, more often for the defenders, which is just the flip side risk taken when making this corridor map style combined with tough attacking armour assets.
When it does work though, the result is a bloody urban brawl with an edge of desperation in defence.
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Played this map 3 times now, and figured out where the 2nd Tiger spawns. Results of the game thus far:
63-0, with 4 flag caps
77-1
66-3 with 31 team points
Having the 2nd Tiger despawn is fine, but with 2 at start and even remotely competent people in them, they never have to truly advance to completely roll the map. I'd say downgrade 1 to a PIVH. Or, on a different note, remove Axis wrenches.
It is too easy to position them with excellent fields of fire, especially if both split the workload and move with infantry.
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"But there were no pz4's in the movie scene BLA BLA BLAAAA!"
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"But there were no pz4's in the movie scene BLA BLA BLAAAA!"
Why was there an actual tiger ??
(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:Pyi_867C0oP9mM:http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r196/trumpedup/TrollFace-1.png&t=1)
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On the Allied side of the bridge, I would like to see better locations for entrenching for providing support fire. IMO, the easiest fix would be to add several oblique lines of fire that provide an element of protection to the Americans and keep the Germans from the quick flag rush that they generally conduct once the bridge flag falls.
Additionally, please remove the tank obstacles from the bridge as they don't even impede the tanks at all.
and, consider adding an ammo kit so the mortar can be replensihed, otherwise get rid of the mortar altogether.
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Better spawnplaces, whats the points of having the bridge if you spawn on the otherside.
The 1e flg always gets overrun in 30 seconds. Whats the use of defending if everyone spawns way back?
Last 3 flags are hell, you spawn way back, get raped by tiger and youll have a nice walk again.
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If everyone spawned right at the flag you would get raped even more...
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Why was there an actual tiger ??
Because the devs do not want to reveal their T-34 (aka the "something nobody wants to know" from the 2.3 changelog) yet, not even a plywood-masked version? (http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/8908/troolsmiley24.gif)
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The map is good (detail excellent)- and tough for the allies. And something to keep in mind is that there is strategy in retreat. It's not over until the last base is taken - damn the tickets!
The map has TWO tigers; which typically attracts skilled squads. Skilled squads, firepower, and armor: these are the Axis advantages.
However, the map for me is really about strategy; and Allies can still win even if your players are fresh and not as well skilled (crack shots). Even though I prefer playing for allies in all cases/conditions; I see the allies winning every time if the tools given are used correctly (win = not having the last base taken).
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One more thing - I'm confused after reading this. Are there AT Mines available on the map, or are there not? If so, can you tell me the vicinity. ;)
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I'd love it if we'd have them SPR sticky bomb type thingys as a pick up on the map..it's got to be done surely?
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In the movie I saw Marder II, i like that, would throw the molotov there. And also Sticky bombs, detonators, more serious allied air power when near defeat.
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My issue with this map is:
1/ It needs only one single flank area... Axis handicap, yes
2/ More pickup kits, less cool spawnable kits for allies... like... erm, zooks?!... Allies rebalanced
Also, each kit should come with reduced ammo. These people had little ammo and were in danger of running out. Their main supplies were limited ammo that were along their fall back positions and that contained finite amount of ammo (actually, highly limited amounts), there WAS at least one ammo-guy and therefore there could/ should be a pickup kit for this imo.
A limited kit used was the improvised sticky bombs. I really think it wouldn't take too much to implement these ingame.
Zooks should NOT be spawn kits, but pickup kits along the area. Sticky bombs are what the allies need to use by default, as well as a single, or at most 2 xpacks like from FH1, drop, lie in wait, use plunger
For the right-flank, there needs to be some section blocked off to make it only one right flank that is covered by the limited ammo mg position (hole in the wall) in that 2-storey building.
This map is about tactics. Hold off the enemy advance by making them bleed troops i.e attrition. The ammo box guys are key to keeping each position going since they have limited ammo.
If the team must fall back (Flag is lost), they can fall back to positions with ammo boxes that resupply them or spawn with their limited ammo, which comes to the same thing
Only when the Germans get across the bridge, does gameplay change to the theoretical.
Until then, consider SPR as a historic event and emulate it properly..
that's my thinking
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You mad? We tested the maps without bazookas, sucked ass. In SP it might be fun that way, but not with someone in the Tiger who is not a stupid bot.
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Considering the Axis can steamroll the Allies as it is, I highly doubt taking away the spawnable zooks and forcing guys to need ammo boxes is going to fix that.
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Amazing map ;) Sb says that 2 Tigers is to much... I don't think so... Obviously on non-crowded serwers Americans might have big troubles but I've played once when there was 20 vs 20 and we were eliminating Tigers well ;) It's all about teamplay 8) Maybe one suggestion - when Germans take Alamo, Americans should have more tanks for counter attacks (maybe one more with 76mm?).
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So, i have just played Ramelle tonight on hslan and that was maybe the most boring round ever played in Ramelle, but not the only.
This map have a real problem with the too much amount of HE rounds, especially in the 2 Tigers. At the end of the battle, the tigers had around 250 kills by their own?!
The germans hadn't taken the bridge and were still bleeding. They win the round 23-0.
You can't say there is not problem with the tigers. One tiger should be enough or, other idea, leave only around 10-15 HE round, which couldn't be reloaded by ammunition box or truck.
The HE will be more important to preserve and the round will not become a HE party for the US.
(http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/1793/screen007p.jpg)
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I udnerstand that getting raped over and over again is boring, I think so myself, too. But I have some questions for you:
At the end of the battle, the tigers had around 250 kills by their own?!
I don't see anyone with over 100 kills and there are only two Tigers. ???
The germans hadn't taken the bridge and were still bleeding. They win the round 23-0.
If this occurs, your team should have been able to win. I have seen allies win several times now without axis being able to cross the bridge. Maybe there were too many guys on your team running towards the Tigers with their pistol, hoping they were Tom Hanks? Seriously, it is about staying alive, because that means tickets.
You can't say there is not problem with the tigers. One tiger should be enough or, other idea, leave only around 10-15 HE round, which couldn't be reloaded by ammunition box or truck.
Apart from the fact that of course I can say there is no problem with the Tigers (like I posted before, kill one and it won't respawn - only one left), the other idea is not possible. An ammobox cannot be coded in a way it only resupplies certain types of ammo.
Good luck on your next round in Ramelle, try to concentrate on defending the northern flags, it has been successfull in the recent past ;)
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I count the 2 drivers and the mg operators (4 players if you want, i haven't counted the PzIV adn the Marder)
But yeah i know how to play this map that's not the problem here.
This HE party now happen too often because players know to play it (like in Anctoville with the PzIV, you can totaly fuck the round by yourself bny sitting on the north road and shoot with your HE on the corner...).
Now in Ramelle, you have just to camp with the tiger and shoot the houses or the spawn with the HE to make that map boring. And if you want to shoot it with your zook, most of the time you're going to be killed by a rifleman who's hiding in a houses.
So for me, the only real problem is the HE round which need to be reduced for the Tigers.
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The problem in Ramelle is certainly not the bazookas, because I have seen them fired even at individual soldiers. No, wait. The problem is just that. Maybe they should be fired at the sides and rear of the Tigers instead. ;D
Also, even when the Germans have the Bridge flag, they still bleed. So if the Americans just waited in cover and not charge madly into the open, they would win eventually. If the Tigers advance further into the town - a necessity for supporting the infantry - they again become much more vulnerable to bazookas. And when they are eliminated - and only then - the Americans can try to take the bridge back. Not when the two kittahs sit at the other side of the river waiting for prey.
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That's why the axis bleed till they reach the other side. The allies are supposed to defend (keep their heads low) and not counter-attack. :)
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Guys...look at your comments, we can't say nothing without beeing for a idiot who don't know to play FH2... This is not the first time i see that in the forum. I just wanted to help to make this map better.
So bye, i will keep my feedback for me next time.
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I agree with the HE shells. If the Germans in the film would have used their HE shells and MGs, private ryan would have ended as a smear on the church wall.
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How many HE shells would a Tiger crew normally have, and how many do the Ramelle Tigers have?
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I agree with the HE shells. If the Germans in the film would have used their HE shells and MGs, private ryan would have ended as a smear on the church wall.
For crying out loud, it's a movie, the bad guys do only what they are scripted to do, not what would be sensible or realistic, so that enough main characters survive for Mr. Spielberg to deliver his intended message.
If you insist on having a "realistic reason" for this, in SP-frakking-R of all things, then maybe the Germans were keeping AP loaded because they knew 76-Shermans would spawn after they cap Alamo flag, or maybe they were afraid of TK'ing n00bish infantry players? ;D
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Guys...look at your comments, we can't say nothing without beeing for a idiot who don't know to play FH2... This is not the first time i see that in the forum. I just wanted to help to make this map better.
So bye, i will keep my feedback for me next time.
Who is calling you an idiot? I think you're a bit overreacting here. We all try to help and make the map better, I just commented on some things which aren't possible.
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The map is fine. Tigers are ungainly in town settings. Wait out the barrage picking off as many infantry as possible, force the tanks into town.
What this map does need is perhaps engineers with cool sticky bombs with the power of 'socks crammed with comp. B' and an xpack with plunger to deal with infantry, so they can continue to keep their heads down till ze kitties are right where they want em
The advantage for the yanks is in the town, and i dare say, the frontmost yank flag should be greyed out so the Americans get the fact that the only time they should go there is with tanks.
If you're getting HEd so much than maybe quit doing what you are doing. Dont fire at the front of the tank or face it head on in the open.
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This route is allowed?
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Actually yes. It doesn't help much, but it is sneak to the front.
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The map is fine. Tigers are ungainly in town settings. Wait out the barrage picking off as many infantry as possible, force the tanks into town.
What this map does need is perhaps engineers with cool sticky bombs with the power of 'socks crammed with comp. B' and an xpack with plunger to deal with infantry, so they can continue to keep their heads down till ze kitties are right where they want em
The advantage for the yanks is in the town, and i dare say, the frontmost yank flag should be greyed out so the Americans get the fact that the only time they should go there is with tanks.
If you're getting HEd so much than maybe quit doing what you are doing. Dont fire at the front of the tank or face it head on in the open.
Did you ever played that killwhore fest map? the HE spam into spawn places is alone enough to stay ahead even of the ticket bleed
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I still wonder why aren't there any spawnable sockybombs...
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I still wonder why aren't there any spawnable sockybombs...
It take time to make, maybe they will make this kind of sticky bomb later, maybe not, like the throwable mortar. :P
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I still wonder why aren't there any spawnable sockybombs...
It take time to make, maybe they will make this kind of sticky bomb later, maybe not, like the throwable mortar. :P
ummm
There IS a stick bomb ingame already ? ? ? ? (!)
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There IS a stick bomb ingame already ? ? ? ? (!)
There would be little point adding the british sticky bomb to Ramelle as a placeholder, since it does not penetrate enough armour to damage the Tiger (iirc, tested by me in 2.15 against the DAK tiger).
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But it would feel awesome to have it (and also there is not only a tiger on this map...There are other vehicles too)
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This might have been mentioned earlier in this thread but, i was lazy, so:
This map might need some optimizations. There are some heavy fps drops in the city.
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Yeah I get that a lot as well.. Often the city fight cripples my pc. Shame, gorgeous map!
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Can someone explain if the Tigers were beefed up here, or why it takes more than 4 shots to kill the Tiger tanks with the wimpier shermans? Example - Operation Totalize low end shermans can do more damage to a Tiger (same with Villers). Only the 76 sherman can deliver decent damage.
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Also NO drilling! WTF!
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Also NO drilling! WTF!
MOAR M30 DRILLING MOAR MOAR MOAR !!!
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Also NO drilling! WTF!
MOAR M30 DRILLING MOAR MOAR MOAR !!!
No seriously, i want more. Drilling is so awesome
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I think that the german mainbase should be further because the allies need more time to set up the ambushes , mg nests , it would be cool for both sides then. ;D
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Sometimes Americans have to wait so loooooooooooooooong for Shermans.... Sometimes Americans has only 1 flag and still no 76 sherman.... The respawning time should be shorten for this tank...
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Just tried 2.4 version of the map in singleplayer and "local server" multiplayer. Some remarks:
1. 2000 tickets at the start seem too much. IIRC 2.3 teams've had 900 tickets and it hasn't felt like too little. For me, it took 2 hours to complete a singleplayer round with ridiculous >1000 score.
2. Unable to climb on ladder, see attached screenshot. Is it a bug?
3. Very weird spawn points. For example, playing as German, you want to spawn at Ruins, but you spawn at Fountain instead, surrounded by Americans. Bridge flag throws Germans as far as Historical Center. Sometimes Americans spawn around German controlled Bridge and Alamo. Looks like it is true only for singleplayer, I couldn't reproduce this spawn weirdness in multiplayer.
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it wont work in singleplayer because it doesnt have the real ticket bleed plugin, that is my guess.
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About tickets ratio. Now it works fine when German team is equally good as allies, or slightly better. It produces time needed for Germans to advance enough, and even win map as they wouldn't with 2.3 tickets.
But with Allied team having skill advantage, it becomes never-ending nightmare of no advance and deathfest for germans. Ticket ratio could maybe use some further tweaking.
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About tickets ratio. Now it works fine when German team is equally good as allies, or slightly better. It produces time needed for Germans to advance enough, and even win map as they wouldn't with 2.3 tickets.
But with Allied team having skill advantage, it becomes never-ending nightmare of no advance and deathfest for germans. Ticket ratio could maybe use some further tweaking.
Push maps like Ramelle are being standardized so both team have the same amout of tickets (1000)
We balance it with the speed of the bleed instead according to a formula of kills per minute VS expected round length which we use.
Tight pushmaps with bridge-locks will always be tough, allthough I agree it can be very hard if the defending team is organised and the attackers play like headless chickens, a problem which goes both ways. ;)
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Push maps like Ramelle are being standardized so both team have the same amout of tickets (1000)
We balance it with the speed of the bleed instead according to a formula of kills per minute VS expected round length which we use.
Tight pushmaps with bridge-locks will always be tough, allthough I agree it can be very hard if the defending team is organised and the attackers play like headless chickens, a problem which goes both ways. ;)
I like it tough, but when attackers are organized and defenders act headless, then attackers will end round quickly. But when it is opposite, then its not about to end soon pretty much creating frustraition which seems to never end. But im glad to hear, that it is somehow balanced by bleed at least. Anyway thanks for your reply.
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Something should be done with second tiger spawn trigger. Nowdays that people know it will spawn when right flank is captured by allies, people will just avoid capturing right flank. And I don't want to be in his pants who actually captures it for US, rage from other US players is huge.
Rather give second tiger when axis captures fountain or rights flank? So that it would be reward for axis doing what they should do, not punishment for allies capturing flag...
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...[Second Tiger] will spawn when right flank is captured by allies...
Holy crap! I swear I didn't know that! From now on I will avoid Right Flank at all costs.
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It's also very delightful to start the round by typing in several messsages into text chat:
ATTENTION! DO NOT CAPTURE RIGHT FLANK, IT GIVES THE GERMANS AN EXTRA TIGGER AND MARDER.
DO NOT CAPTURE THE RIGHT FLANK, IT GIVES GERMANS MORE TANKS
SQUAD 4, DO NOT CAPTURE THE RIGHT FLANK
SQUAD 4, LEAVE THE FLAGZONE NAOUW!
ADMIN, CAN I PLEASE TEAMKILL EVERYONE IN SQUAD 4 WITHOUT PUNISHMENT SINCE THEY ARE CLEARLY TRAITORS?
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^^ this XD
I must admit that maybe the second Tiger could spawn latter in the battle. Ramelle is already a rapefest for americans and an orgasm for the german statwhore who drives the Tiger. The second could spawn once Fountain is cap. And maybe a Sherman could spawn once the second Tiger spawns ? So this way Both tanks will arrive around the bridge at the same time, like it the movie.
And also, could it be possible to add a mortar kit at american base, or a ammo kit because the mortar for USA is verry usefull and in general when the mortar dont have any ammo left, the round is almost finish...
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Maybe Natty wants to tell us that wheter something has been changed about the second Tiger spawn^^
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Afaik this map is not Natty's responsibility. Otolikos is the mapper.
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And also, could it be possible to add a mortar kit at american base, or a ammo kit because the mortar for USA is verry usefull and in general when the mortar dont have any ammo left, the round is almost finish...
Here's what Otolikos replied to similar suggestion:
I've placed "7" Ammo boxes not ammo kits....... Mortar has only 39 rockets, after that there is no more rockets. unlimited ammo for mortar will be hell for axis team.....every time i play this map, axis team can't reach the bridge.....:/
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But his post have been made in 2010, things have changed on this map, now I must say that germans are often able to cap all flags. Maybe a ammo kit now could be more usefull.
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Dunno, I've seen all possible variants in 2.4: Germans not able to get over the bridge, Germans get over the bridge but then pushed back, Germans capture all flags.
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I have to say that I have seen all possibility too, but if the german didnt get further than the first command post either their entire team consisted of noobs or the Tiger got teamkilled by a Marder something like this. So not a map related issue in my opinion.
The Germans not crossing the bridge: Probably the Allieds didnt capture the right flank. And even if this is the case its not a rape seccion for either side, so I think this is acceptable. The Allied team was probably quite good.
But at least the 10 last rounds I played the game ended for the Allieds without any command post left. As it has been down many times before: Detach the second Tiger from right flank, capping a command post shouldnt be a disatvantage for a team. Make it spawn later or (and this is my favorite) have it spawn only one time (if this is codeable).
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have it spawn only one time (if this is codeable).
I think it's possible in a certain way. Spawntime is the time before the vehicle will spawn at base if the vehicle is destroyed. If you put a verry high time, I imagine that once he spawned, he will not spawn again before the end of the round.
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There is a function for spawning only once.
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Yea... but that goes against the core of multiplayer design. Better suited for singleplayer experience.
In a MP map, you dont play one scenario, once. You're kind of like stuck in a "loop" like groundhog's day with Bill Murray :) There is no time and space in MP design... WW2 never ends...
to add to that there's bunch of other things to consider.. what about the guy who joins mid-round to use this tank, how does he know it wont respawn. what if some noob destroys it immediately as it spawns..etcetc... Battlefield differs alot from ex CS in this way. It's more forgiving. if you screw up you get a fresh start again and again. To have one feature suddenly break that, it just feels icky.
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A suggestion, can you remove the smoke grenades from both sides and add a grenade to the rifleman kit, please?
Everytime I play Ramelle both on SP and MP I just cant see anything because everywhere is covered with useless smoke. Also I didn't see any smoke grenades used on the Ramelle fights in the movie SPR. (It's based on that movie afaik?)
Also about the grenades, the rifleman kit is just so pale and useless with only the M1 Garand, bayonet, and field dressing. A grenade would sure decrease the mildness IMO.
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Another one, add some hawkins mine pickup kits which you encounter frequently on the battlefield, the movie had them.
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no smoke in SPR final battle scenes? :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-pMP1cHDAA
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no smoke in SPR final battle scenes? :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-pMP1cHDAA
Huh? That's a clip from Stalingrad.
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no smoke in SPR final battle scenes? :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-pMP1cHDAA
Huh? That's a clip from Stalingrad.
Wait until he proves you wrong. You only THINK it's Stalingrad, it's clever design. ;)
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lmao
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2nd tiger spawn its worst thing of fh2 yesterday we lost all flag till alamo as well as germans always send us a tiger wecan destroy but as soon as a new tiger seen on the horizon
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2.46 changelog for Ramelle-Neuville 64 (Allied bias!)
- The after-Alamo sector push was replaced with the 2.4-style push (no sectors, the Americans can counter-attack).
- Raised the speed of the German ticket bleed from 11 to 13 tickets per minute.
- The current order of German armour spawning:
- The first Tiger spawns until the Germans capture all flags of the first sector: Ruins, Right Flank and Fountain, with 5 minutes delay at the start.
- The second Tiger and one of the Marders spawn until the Germans capture Right Flank.
- One Marder spawns whole round.
- Right Flank is now controlled by the Americans from the start.
- The Marders I were replaced with Marders III M.
- Lowered the spawntimes of the reinforcement Shermans to 120 sec instead of 150 and 300 sec.
- The 57mm mobile AT gun at US Reinforcements was replaced with 2 76mm mobile AT guns at US Reinforcements and Crossroads.
- Raised the limit for the Bazooka kit by 1 (for 32 players in the team).
- US spawnpoint tweaks.
- Fixed misplaced M1919A4 tripod and some pickup kits.
- Multiple cosmetic (visual) fixes.
Minimap for reference:
(http://i61.tinypic.com/n6ues3.jpg)
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So no more "don't cap right flag or I will kill you all" in US team! ;D
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Oops, yes, I forgot to add that most important change to the changelog, fixed now.
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Well, I noticed the change basing on minimap ;)
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2.5 changelog for Ramelle 64
- One of the Tigers now spawns the whole round, again.
- Closed some "secret" sneaky routes behind ruins and fences, mostly in the first half of the map.
- The mobile Flak now spawns when the German team captures Ruins (instead of spawning with a 3 minutes delay from the start, no matter if the Germans control Ruins or not).
- Minor cosmetic fixes.
Minimap for reference:
(http://i61.tinypic.com/n6ues3.jpg)
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2.56 Changelog for Ramelle 64
- Fix Exploit