Lets remember.

[Schneider]

Yes, that is true, but that has nothing to do with the fact that there are no Argentinian people living on the island.

I don't want to critize anything on the analysis you and sheik and Meadow have given, hats off, everything fine and true.
Just wanted to comment on this one - as for back then, it clearly had nothing to do with the fact that their lived no Argentinians on the island.
But it has something to do with the fact that there are no Argentinian people living on the island, because they can't live on the island because they can't enter it.

Sorry for being Captain Obvious here, but this surely noticed but not spoken disaccord just jumped in my face and digged its claws in my cheeks until I wrote it down.

[Fuchs]

No. But we're not at a funeral. We're on the forum of a historical-interest community.

Que?

I still maintain it was grossly irresponsible for the British government of the time to provoke the Argentines like they did - months before the invasion the British garrison requested an upgrade in weaponry from SMLEs. It was rejected. In the late 1970s, James Callaghan had scared the Junta into backing down from a similar attack when he sent the Ark Royal and a task force to patrol the Falklands when Argentine troop buildup was detected. The Thatcher government did the very opposite, practically inviting them in - it is not surprising that many consider this a selfish war to save her reputation.

Nevertheless, the Junta too is to blame, of course. Both governments acted beyond foolishly and interestingly for similar aims - to assuage public opinion that was turning against them. Let us hope that never again will governments throw 1000 lives away for their own personal gain.

May all who died rest in peace - the individual soldiers were, as ever, heroes. 

We are remembering dead people. I believe thats quite equal to a funeral.

[Meadow]

We are remembering dead people. I believe thats quite equal to a funeral.

Well there you and I disagree. A memorial thread posted without any political spin on the topic would be more appropriate for what you describe, but the opening post of this topic made it clear that discussion should be encouraged on this topic. If we have to treat everything that involves dead people as a funeral, why are any of us playing FH2?

[Fuchs]

Well I take back my first post in this thread then. I clearly misunderstood the purpose off it. I seriously thought it was about remembering fallen soldiers. Anyways I'll be out of here.

[VonMudra]

Yes, that is true, but that has nothing to do with the fact that there are no Argentinian people living on the island.

I don't want to critize anything on the analysis you and sheik and Meadow have given, hats off, everything fine and true.
Just wanted to comment on this one - as for back then, it clearly had nothing to do with the fact that their lived no Argentinians on the island.
But it has something to do with the fact that there are no Argentinian people living on the island, because they can't live on the island because they can't enter it.

Sorry for being Captain Obvious here, but this surely noticed but not spoken disaccord just jumped in my face and digged its claws in my cheeks until I wrote it down.

Problem is, because it was uninhabited, the claim has always been in the air.  At first the french landed, and left a plaque saying it was owned by France.  Then Britian did the same.  Then Spain.  Then Britain.  Then Argentina.  Then Britain again.  So if the Argentinians want to rely all their claim on the island due to a plaque that an American privateer hired by their government left on the Falklands, then the French and Spanish have as equal claim to them as the British and French do.

Also, the main thing is that is shouldn't be decided by who landed first, it should be decided by who lives there.  And when 99% of the population is of British descent, it speaks volumes.  Would the population change if Argentinians were allowed to move there?  No.  It sure stayed the same throughout the rest of the history of the Falklands, it wouldn't now.  IN fact, the main immigrants to the island, other then the british, were Uruguayan.

[Torenico]

Well.. i really find the "NO Argentinians allowed in the Falklands" a bit too much STUPID. yes.. Germans are allowed in Moscow.. Americans are Allowed in China.. Russians are Allowed in Washington.. i just dont get it.

Just.. does the UK needs the falklands? whats in there? just a town called Stanley and a couple of little villages.. thats all.. theres nothing but Cold and a reduced Population.. and its faar faaaar away from the UK Mainland..

[VonMudra]

A very, very loyally British population, and a very important and major UK naval and air base as well.

[Eat Uranium]

Just.. does the UK needs the falklands? whats in there? just a town called Stanley and a couple of little villages.. thats all.. theres nothing but Cold and a reduced Population.. and its faar faaaar away from the UK Mainland..

There is supposed to be one of the last great oil reserves in the seabed around the falklands.  Plus all the fishing and minerals, the islands are a very lucrative place.  But its the promise of oil thats got everyones attention.

[Meadow]

If the people of the Falklands want to be part of Britain, let them. It's not hurting anyone or causing a rift among the local population like in Northern Ireland (where I do support the eventual secession of the 6 counties to the RoI), so why solve a problem that isn't there? Gibraltar is slightly different given how it's attached to Spain but once again the right to self-determination, one of the few good things to come out of Versailles, is surely a cornerstone of western values?

Oh, and Fuchs - no harm done, I was perhaps a little short with you. I just wasn't comfortable with what you appeared to be suggesting, but clearly it was a misunderstanding on both our parts. Peace

[Torenico]

Well.. you guys convinced me.. Political maps says "Islas Malvinas (ARG)" Of course they are Argentinian maps..... never ending disscusion.

But all i want is.. all Argentinian citizen should be allowed to travel to the Islands.. whitout any restrinction.  OF course dont break the law like killing an Falklander (?)..

[Fuchs]

Oh, and Fuchs - no harm done, I was perhaps a little short with you. I just wasn't comfortable with what you appeared to be suggesting, but clearly it was a misunderstanding on both our parts. Peace

Always Meadow. No hard feelings  I just got annoyed a little so there I went. Peace for sure.

[VonMudra]

Gibraltar is a similar issue.  A fiercely loyal British populace, but its claimed by spain.

@ Torenico:  I see no problem in that, I agree 100%.  I just don't think Argentina has any claim to owning the islands

[Lobo]

Like Hong-Kong or Shangai?

Gibraltar is a big issue because the evil tommies don't want to give up such an strategic place, but is one of the last examples of Empire colony, so now to the next step: descolonization...or build a real Europe

It's not clear who discovered Las Malvinas, Spain and Great Britain claim to be the first ones...obviously

[Meadow]

I'm flattered that a passing comment by yours truly drove Lobo out of hiding

And I'm not sure it really can be called colonialism - the people of Gibraltar are not Spaniards, they are British, and wish to remain so. Why evict them or subject them to rule they do not wish to have for the sake of a few miles of craggy rock?

It's not like Hong Kong or Shanghai, either - in both cases the native population lived alongside a minority of British citizens. There was consensus that these natives wished to become part of the rest of their homeland. When that can be found in Gibraltar, then perhaps the debate can restart with legitimate arguments.

[Lobo]

It was spaniard land, with spaniard habitants, stolen after a war some centuries ago, so it's a colonial subject. The Gibraltar people obviously want to stay as they are now, with their economic "special status".

Hey, but do I care?, I am internationalist