Forgotten Hope 2 > Suggestions
Poll: Should I Add Tear Gas to a PzB 38 Cartridge?
Pa3ym2:
The German PzB 38 anti-tank rifle is the least powerful and ineffective in the game. I propose a way to strengthen it. In reality, German anti-tank guns were supplied with tear gas cartridges
>Firearms using this round
>Panzerbüchse 38 Anti-tank rifle
>Panzerbüchse 39 Anti-tank rifle
>(Rs) stands for "Reizstoff", which means tear gas, because the projectile contains a small capsule of tear gas
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.92%C3%9794mm_Patronen
Weapons specialist, writer, and researcher of Soviet archives Andrei Ulanov testifies that the Germans used such cartridges against Soviet tanks. There are repeated reports from Soviet tank crews that after such gas cartridges hit the tank, it became impossible to be inside the tanks, and the crews left them (6:44) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGHVim9kTBc
Similar cartridges for Soviet anti-tank rifles were also developed in the USSR, but they did not go into production.
I would like such cartridges to be implemented in the game as a separate firing mode for an anti-tank rifle, similar to the bipod firing mode of a machine gun. It is not necessary to make all the cartridges of the anti-tank rifle gas, it is enough that, for example, 20 cartridges were ordinary, and another 5 were gas with a separate firing mode. You can take the animation of the dimming and reddening of the screen when the player is injured, repaint it from red to green, and add it to the crew inside the tank when after such a gas cartridge enters the tank.
Ts4EVER:
The suppression effect in FH2 is already a repurposed tear gas effect from the BF2 special forces expansion. I don't think this could be applied to vehicles, only infantry.
Pa3ym2:
--- Quote from: Ts4EVER on 11-11-2021, 10:11:13 ---The suppression effect in FH2 is already a repurposed tear gas effect from the BF2 special forces expansion. I don't think this could be applied to vehicles, only infantry.
--- End quote ---
Is it possible to somehow realize the effect of gas inside armored vehicles in a different way?
I read that if you inhale a lot of tear gas, then pulmonary edema occurs and the person dies. Is it possible then to make sure that when a gas cartridge hits the tank, there is no visual effect from the gas, but the character begins to "groan" inside the vehicle, slowly receive damage. And if he did not get out of the tank within 40-50 seconds, then he died.
jan_kurator:
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 07:11:46 ---The German PzB 38 anti-tank rifle is the least powerful and ineffective in the game.
--- End quote ---
This not true. You base this opinion on?
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 07:11:46 ---German anti-tank guns were supplied with tear gas cartridges
--- End quote ---
Those are also famous for not having any impact at all. Capsules broke on the impact and if shot penetrated, any damage done inside the tank was mostly caused by shrapnel. It even says that in the article you brought up "The idea was impractical due to the core penetrating the armor and leaving the capsule outside. "
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 07:11:46 ---Weapons specialist, writer, and researcher of Soviet archives Andrei Ulanov testifies that the Germans used such cartridges against Soviet tanks.
--- End quote ---
It is well known those were used, but those were useless and Germans quickly switched to tungsten core bullets which achieved much better penetration, as a matter of fact, I doubt any tear gas bullets were still in use during Op. Barbarossa.
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 07:11:46 ---There are repeated reports from Soviet tank crews that after such gas cartridges hit the tank, it became impossible to be inside the tanks, and the crews left them (6:44) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGHVim9kTBc
--- End quote ---
Please give us repeated reports with sources other than random YouTube video. We base our research on proper documents whenever we can.
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 07:11:46 ---Similar cartridges for Soviet anti-tank rifles were also developed in the USSR, but they did not go into production.
--- End quote ---
For the same reason, those were simply useless.
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 07:11:46 ---I would like such cartridges to be implemented in the game as a separate firing mode for an anti-tank rifle, similar to the bipod firing mode of a machine gun. It is not necessary to make all the cartridges of the anti-tank rifle gas, it is enough that, for example, 20 cartridges were ordinary, and another 5 were gas with a separate firing mode. You can take the animation of the dimming and reddening of the screen when the player is injured, repaint it from red to green, and add it to the crew inside the tank when after such a gas cartridge enters the tank.
--- End quote ---
Not historically accurate for the period FH2 maps are based on. Not desired
--- Quote from: Pa3ym2 on 11-11-2021, 10:11:29 ---Is it possible to somehow realize the effect of gas inside armored vehicles in a different way?
--- End quote ---
No.
Pa3ym2:
--- Quote from: jan_kurator on 11-11-2021, 11:11:24 ---No.
--- End quote ---
Andrei Ulanov also said that there were two types of cartridges for the Soviet anti-tank guns PTRD / PTRS. The old BS-32 cartridge had an armor penetration of about 20-25 mm of armor at 500 meters. But in 1941, Soviet gunsmiths designed a new BS-41 cartridge with a carbide and tungsten core with much higher armor penetration. The new BS-41 cartridge had an armor penetration of about 40 mm of armor at a distance of 500 m.
http://shooting-iron.ru/publ/18-1-0-1664
This made it possible to penetrate the side of the "Panther" tank if it was not covered by a protective screen. Andrey Ulanov confirms that such BS-41 cartridges began to enter the troops at the end of 1941, but they were few and always in short supply (10:36) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGHVim9kTBc
Because of this, in 1943, the Germans began to close the sides of their tanks with protective screens that protected not only from cumulative shells, but also from these new BS-41 cartridges (37:21) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGHVim9kTBc
I said this to the fact that in addition to the German gas cartridges, in addition to the main ammunition of cartridges, 5 new BS-41 cartridges with greater armor penetration than other cartridges could be added to Soviet anti-tank guns
Is it possible to realize at least the second type of cartridges for PTRD / PTRS with greater armor penetration?
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