Forgotten Hope Public Forum

Announcements => Developer Blogs => Topic started by: Ts4EVER on 07-06-2012, 14:06:04

Title: Pushing on
Post by: Ts4EVER on 07-06-2012, 14:06:04
Push has been a standard game mode in both FH 1 and 2. Now we are proud to announce the next version of push mode:

Sector push

Sector push is a new game mode that will be available on several new and old FH2 maps. It was designed to create a new tactical experience in FH2 and has been applied to maps that required a true progression in order to work as intended. In the standard push mode, the attackers risk losing all their progress and be set back to square one if the defenders re-take all their newly aquired control points, whilst in Sector Push, they have a possibility to secure a certain stage (a sector) of the map. This mechanic is not prefered on maps like Siege Of Tobruk, which is a classic push map where we'd actually want the defenders to be able to reclaim their lines, but on maps like Falaise Pocket or Purple Heart Lane we rather wanted the action to move on.
A sector push map is divided into several sectors, each of which consists of two or more flags that have to be captured by the attacking team. Once they accomplish this, all flags in this sector are locked and the next sector is opened for attack. The task of the defending team is to hold their position and to mount immediate counter attack once a flag is taken. If it comes to the worst and a sector falls, they have to fall back and fight in the next.
Sector Push uses the same ticket system that was already introduced on Ramelle and Hurtgen Forest in Forgotten Hope 2.4. That means the attackers have to keep attacking until the last sector is cleared. Kills have but a small effect on the final victory, it is all about playing the objective and capturing or defending ground. This means that only aggressive and dynamic tactics will lead to success: there is no leaning back and camping it out on a sector push map!

Many maps have been redesigned to use this new game mode. In future dev blogs we will go into more detail about some of those. In most cases the loading screen description will inform the player that he is joining a Sector Push map, but in some cases only one sector has been added (such in the case of Pointe du Hoc, Supercharge and Operation Cobra) A sector is easily recognised in game by control points being locked with the red X icons, so a player will always know if he can or can not attack a control point.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Biiviz on 07-06-2012, 14:06:32
Sounds awesome.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: evhgear on 07-06-2012, 14:06:07
interresting, it looks like the rush mode introduced in Bad Company, it will probably attract some new players. Since it will be only on certain maps, I like the idea. I imagine that Hurtgen and Ramelle will be one of the firsts maps to introduce this new mode.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: LuckyOne on 07-06-2012, 14:06:30
Cool, it's amazing how you guys always seek to improve things... Keep up the good work!  ;)
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Kelmola on 07-06-2012, 14:06:47
Partybunker no moar? Awwwwww.

j/k, many of the maps could have used "irreversible push" tbh.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: LuckyOne on 07-06-2012, 15:06:57
Partybunker no moar? Awwwwww.

Partybunker was getting older every day. Besides I always felt it was stupid that the devs spent so much time detailing areas of the maps that were rarely played (like the endbase of PDH or last flags of PHL). It felt like a waste. Now we might actually see some cool action there in regular 64 player maps not only in the rarely played 32p and 16p versions.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Surfbird on 07-06-2012, 16:06:17
Sounds really good. I'm corious how t's going to influence the gameplay. Depends on the maps if I like it. On some it's definitely an improvement. Let's see what maps you cange and how they play out. I don't think it makes anything worse, probably just different.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: DaWorg! on 07-06-2012, 16:06:06
Looks primising, i always enjoyed fighting retreat from 3 first flags on PHL as German
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Wakain on 07-06-2012, 17:06:25
it's odd, I was thinking about game mechanics for a possible upcoming pacific front last week that would suit american beach landings and the japanese defensive fighting style (retreat from the beaches + sudden aggressive counterattack, if this fails further retreat, eventually to a well-dug defensive line, preferably in or bordering mountainous areas, front stabilizes + probing attacks/harrasment, if all goes down the drain attack in force etc.) and came up with more or less exactly this kind of gamemode.

Anyway, it sounds like an exciting gamemode, fighting retreats and aggressive counterattacking ftw! This could also mean (depending on the map ofc) fighting will be focused (even) more!
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Zulnex on 07-06-2012, 19:06:06
Sounds splendid. Keep up the amazing work Developers and Beta Testers. 8)
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Raziel on 07-06-2012, 19:06:14
Great work! It's always nice to see new gameplay changes and hopefully this will create more teamplay.  :)
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: LtnGeorge on 07-06-2012, 20:06:36
Sounds great,
We at world at war played with such a pushcode before.
It was on a custom map made by Lainer called MDI.

We will play this map again on the 16th of june I believe (it is one of the last maps in campaign 25)

Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: sheikyerbouti on 07-06-2012, 22:06:38
 As a premise this sounds quite interesting. It should make for some newfound action in parts of the maps that we don't get to see often.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: AdamPA1006 on 08-06-2012, 00:06:27
Partybunker no moar? Awwwwww.

j/k, many of the maps could have used "irreversible push" tbh.

First off, thank you to the Devs for providing us this info and being diligent about posting the dev blogs. I know many members like myself have really been enjoying them. Second, I love partybunker, its one of my most favorite things to do in FH2. I will never give that up!!
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Tuco on 08-06-2012, 05:06:06
Thank you for keeping us up to date, and new game modes are always welcome.  :)
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: ww2fighter20 on 10-06-2012, 21:06:15
I was just thinking about it: how about the ai for these maps which contain this new mode, are they reworked or is there no dev for now?
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Natty on 10-06-2012, 21:06:04
No current AI dev.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Tuco on 10-06-2012, 23:06:50
No current AI dev.

http://www.nooooooooooooooo.com/
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Kuupperi on 19-06-2012, 11:06:34
Seems such a great idea. It just might increase some more teamwork and the importance of defending. Besides this brings the fights in a few places at a time so there will be way more action while two teams are seriously fighting of the control of those flags. Especially very special gamemode for those players who like to attack and attack like there was no tomorrow.

Might work perfectly in some Finnish maps when we get them (if ever will). The Finns defending against the Soviet attacks in their trenches and bunkers. I guess I'm getting too excited here?  ;D
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: titsmcgee852 on 19-06-2012, 15:06:09
If there is no AI dev, does that mean that maps like Lebisey that have sector push won't be playable in singleplayer anymore, or will it still be on its original mode? (please tell me this will be the case :()
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Darman on 19-06-2012, 16:06:30
Even more  important: Does "no AI Dev" mean, new maps like St. Vith won#t be playable in Coop?
If so - Well I could delete that point from my list because that would mean FH2.45 just became uninteresting and not worth downloading. Please tell us. 
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Zoologic on 19-06-2012, 17:06:48
Well, sometimes the new maps will have navmesh to begin with and the bot to roam with, but it will be far from perfect. But at least playable in MP, just the bots won't go inside buildings and do stuffs like in properly navmeshed maps by the AI devs.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Steel_Lion_FIN on 19-06-2012, 17:06:26
Even more  important: Does "no AI Dev" mean, new maps like St. Vith won#t be playable in Coop?
If so - Well I could delete that point from my list because that would mean FH2.45 just became uninteresting and not worth downloading. Please tell us.

To be blunt, downloading FH2 for only single player is like hiring a prostitute just to do push-ups.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Wakain on 19-06-2012, 17:06:15
Even more  important: Does "no AI Dev" mean, new maps like St. Vith won#t be playable in Coop?
If so - Well I could delete that point from my list because that would mean FH2.45 just became uninteresting and not worth downloading. Please tell us.

To be blunt, downloading FH2 for only single player is like hiring a prostitute just to do push-ups.

sure, but still there are people who have bad internet connections or simply prefer sp.
It's just half the experience but if you don't know any better it'll do perfectly.

I have an excellent internet connection but still I sometimes just like to slug it out with bots.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Darman on 19-06-2012, 22:06:16
I played lots of MP with Forgotten Honor. But theres not always the server with the map on I want to play at times. So I just start a coop match. At every time I want. Its fun. Even if the AI is realy stupid.

But I mostly play Coop. With a friend or my brother. Just when I want it, with my settings. FH2 means coop to me. Whole BF2 does.
It also gives you the opportunity to play the class you want, grab the vehicle you want, rock the map as tank driver instead of getting destroyed very fast by other human players. It allows you to play music in the background and lets you enjoy the pure epicness and awesome leveldesign of the mod - because you don't need to pay attention as you would in MP.

As much as I enjoyed tactics, strategy and teamplay with Forgotten Honor - I love the Coop mode too or even more.

And now, back to the topic! After I get a clear answer to: Will FH2.45 bring NEW coop-support maps?
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: ww2fighter20 on 20-06-2012, 00:06:27
I also like to play sp, it plays different then mp and like Darman said you can play which map you want at any time you want against even more then 64 players, also what I like very much in sp is that you can edit the vehicles and weapons used in the maps which can also be fun(Gazala Tiger II vs Pershing ;)).
I known the ai is stupid in many ways but it is the most dangerous enemy in all static weapons.

I further have 2 questions

Are the new vehicles usable by ai or do they cause ctd?
Is the ESAI project from Void applied to the sp maps?
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: jan_kurator on 20-06-2012, 09:06:42
No current AI dev.
I think that this is sufficient answer for most questions here. Hopefully someone will fix SP issues after the release.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Darman on 20-06-2012, 11:06:52
this is still no answer. No AI Dev can mean no new SP/Coop maps at all but can also mean just no new AI vehicles, no fix for the commorose commands to AIs and no new Weapons used by AIs.

But many mappers are also capable of adding just AI support to their maps without being AI Developers.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: DLFReporter on 20-06-2012, 12:06:38
Just expect the worst Darman, manpower is really needed atm.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: titsmcgee852 on 20-06-2012, 13:06:35
I think it would be good to have both the option of multiplayer sector push for maps like St.Vith, and on SP have such maps on regular push mode. Making maps like Lebisey exclusively sector push, meaning no SP anymore, will just push people who don't have good internet connections, i.e. me, away from the game. Yes this requires more manpower, but I'm more than willing to wait.
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: DLFReporter on 20-06-2012, 13:06:39
If you know someone who can map, please lobby him to help out with FH2. Or better yet, if you have the time to wait, then go ahead and check some tutorials, learn AI modding and join the team yourself!
A lot of good modders started out that way. :)
Title: Re: Pushing on
Post by: Eat Uranium on 20-06-2012, 14:06:00
Just going to point out that old SP/COOP layers are very unlikely to have been updated to use new push logic, since this would involve the work of an AI dev to make sure it worked properly.  I think there may be a couple of new navmeshes (but don't quote me on this and I also don't know how good they are).