italian stuff

[Torenico]

Damn i love Cannone da 90/53, poor Mattys, poor everyone!. Would be the perfect replacement for the 88 on Bardia, and it could be on any other map too!


Such a badass Cannone!

[THeTA0123]

let us not forget the truck mounted 90/53 wich where present in pretty decent numbers

[Eat Uranium]

Anyone can tell me what were the most common Carcano variants in use during the war (and if the proportions changed as time went by)?

[THeTA0123]

Well the one thing carcano's have in common is that all variants where infact, common

You ofcourse have the main infantry rifle, the Modello 1891. Used by frontline troops

The M1891 Moschetto da Cavalleria with integrnal Bayonet,
Production=
BRESCIA 1893-1919
BRESCIA (F.N.A. Brescia) 1932-1942
TERNI 1928-1938
BERETTA 1935-1943
GARDONE VAL TROMPIA 1935-1942
This one was origenally for cavalry, motorcycle troops and such but also for engineers,supply personell
This one is the most common Carbine PRE WW2. Production After 1935 all became modello 38's with fixed rear sights and the typical red wood

The Moschetto per Truppe Speciali Mod. 91 was reserved for machine gun crews, mortar crews, artillery personell

BReSCIA 1898-1919
TERNI 1928-1929
BERETTA 1928-1938 (compresa la produzione civile)
GARDONE VAL TROMPIA 1928-1938
PIETRO LORENZOTTI 1930-31
M.B.T. Metallurgica Bresciana Tempini  1930
F.N.A. Brescia  1931-1938 (compresa la produzione civile)
CANNA  (visualizzazione flash)    (visualizzazione html)The Moschetto di Fanteria Mod. 91/24  in turn was a modification of the origenal moschetto M1891

The moschetto di fanteria M91/24 was only produced=
TERNI 1924 -1929

So i would dub this one as less common

The grenade launching carcano was also decently common. In theory issued one per platoon
http://www.il91.it/il91.html

The modello 38 in 7.35 was produced for several years, but in large numbers by many companies. Same goes for a Truppi speciali model with folding bayonet. These have the Red wood commonly.

After 1940 modello 38 production went back to 6.5x52 carcano. These are often found with standard beech wood.
Fucile(Infantry rifle, already ingame, Moschetto Truppi speciali (shorter then infantry rifle) and Moschetto (Folding bayonet integral). These where all again produced in rather large numbers. Again produced by many companies

And then finnaly the M91/41 carcano. Shorter then origenal Carcano infantry rifle, longer then modello 38. Produced from 1941 till 1945.
TERNI 1941 -1943
ARMAGUERRA CREMONA 1942 -1945


So it is difficult to say, wich one was more common. Because they all appeared. The sole carcano collector i encounterd on militaria fairs, said that for every 1.5 infantry rifles produced, one carbine model was produced.

Some notes however
-7.35x51mm Carcanos where NOT issued to North africa (They where issued to East front italian troops)
-There are NO true sniper versions, only a handfull of prototypes or self made sniper rifles

The best site i found about the Italian carcano, is this one

http://www.il91.it/il91.html

But it is in italian.

[psykfallet]

Damn i love Cannone da 90/53, poor Mattys, poor everyone!. Would be the perfect replacement for the 88 on Bardia, and it could be on any other map too!


Such a badass Cannone!

I don't know about Bardia in particular but Italians imported both pak35 and 88's

[Eat Uranium]

So in theory, if FH2 got new models for Italian rifles, then the order of preference would be:

• Fucile 1891
• Moschetto 1891
• Fucile 38 (6.5)
• Fucile 38 (7.35)
• Moschetto 1891 T.S.

The grenade launcher, while novel, was out of service in '34.

[THeTA0123]

this depends, regarding the grenade launcher. Because the italian site mentions that they where used beyond that, infact production was resumed in 1938

For North africa, the fucile di fanteria M1891(ingame), Moschetto di cavaleria 1891(integral bayonet) and Moschetto 1891 T.S would probaly be the most common yes. These 3 would be the most common on all italian fronts FH2 will someday use (NA and eastfront)

As for the Invasion of italy, should that ever come to FH2. The modello 38's will appear much more common.

[Torenico]

Damn i love Cannone da 90/53, poor Mattys, poor everyone!. Would be the perfect replacement for the 88 on Bardia, and it could be on any other map too!


Such a badass Cannone!

I don't know about Bardia in particular but Italians imported both pak35 and 88's

Almost sure that the Italians had 90/53s in Bardia, like, they needed heavy anti aircraft guns, not just a bunch of Breda 35 20mm AA.

Cannone da 75/46 too, why not, Germans used them in the Invasion of Italy.

I dont know, as long as the Italians get L3/35s im happy.

[psykfallet]

this depends, regarding the grenade launcher. Because the italian site mentions that they where used beyond that, infact production was resumed in 1938

the problem with italian weapons, no good reliable information. like that cup attachment, havent even seen a source for that. And Bomba a Mano L; no year of introdution or production numbers..

[THeTA0123]

this depends, regarding the grenade launcher. Because the italian site mentions that they where used beyond that, infact production was resumed in 1938

the problem with italian weapons, no good reliable information. like that cup attachment, havent even seen a source for that. And Bomba a Mano L; no year of introdution or production numbers..

The carcano collector i went to, has a Grenade launcher carcano from 1938

Damn i love Cannone da 90/53, poor Mattys, poor everyone!. Would be the perfect replacement for the 88 on Bardia, and it could be on any other map too!


Such a badass Cannone!

I don't know about Bardia in particular but Italians imported both pak35 and 88's

Almost sure that the Italians had 90/53s in Bardia, like, they needed heavy anti aircraft guns, not just a bunch of Breda 35 20mm AA.

Cannone da 75/46 too, why not, Germans used them in the Invasion of Italy.

I dont know, as long as the Italians get L3/35s im happy.

Both 90/53 and 75/46 WHERE used at bardia. These guns where widely deployed across the entire North africa campaign

[THeTA0123]

ah some quick corrections

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Bardia

breda 20mm guns where used
75/46 where used
90/53 was NOT used

The italians had very large number of artillery. both anti-tank as field artillery

Tank forces where 13 M13/40 and 113 L3/35 tankettes

[Torenico]

ah some quick corrections

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Bardia

breda 20mm guns where used
75/46 where used
90/53 was NOT used

The italians had very large number of artillery. both anti-tank as field artillery

Tank forces where 13 M13/40 and 113 L3/35 tankettes

I dont trust Wikipedia. I mean, i think it makes no sense. Just a bunch of 20mm AAs? I bet all you want that they had 75mm or anything else.

[Thorondor123]

ah some quick corrections

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Bardia

breda 20mm guns where used
75/46 where used
90/53 was NOT used

The italians had very large number of artillery. both anti-tank as field artillery

Tank forces where 13 M13/40 and 113 L3/35 tankettes

I dont trust Wikipedia.

This:


Versus

You saying "it makes no sense". No offence but... source criticism 101.

[Torenico]

Oops, misread then. Thought THETA was saying that no 75/46 were used.

Now that makes more sense, since Mussolini considered Bardia as a strategic position, no wonder the Italians deployed heavy AA Guns to defend it. I mean, using just 20mm for Air Defenses is just stupid.


One step closer to see the Cannone da 75/46 in FH2!

[psykfallet]

What's Bardia without Bardia Bill?  It's the same gun that is on Pointe du Hoc!