Poll

How player death could be improved?

Leave it as it is now - it works fine!
Increase respawn time
Increase incapacitation time to 15sec  --> lower gameplay speed and "add a new death cam" - ppl care about their lifes more!
Increase it drastically --> as above but respawn time annoying long --> makes ppl "scared" to die

Author Topic: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!  (Read 2260 times)

Offline jan_kurator

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 2.546
  • Magnificent Mustard
    • View Profile
As I noticed on this forum some of people complain about to much "run 'n' gun" in Forgotten Hope. Well I must agree with fact that FH2 gameplay is often too fast paced, mostly on infantry maps and it reminds of CoD sometimes. Why it looks like this? Players just don't give a shit about their lives in game, and they don't care if they die after ramboing some control points on the maps as long as they got a chance to be lucky and capture them brainlessly. What should prevent from ppl from doing that? INREASING RESPAWN TIME - but we can make it in way which adds more immersion to the game. Respawn time is about 15sec on most servers right now and I want to leave this in this way because it is needed to let players "catch" their respawn wave. Thing that could be changed is time of soldier being incapacitated (set to 1sec by default to prevent ragdoll bugs).

Main advantages of increasing incapacitation time are:
  • make ppl care more about their lifes in game --> slowing gameplay
  • incapacitation time would work as "new" death cam - vanillaBF2 style - soldier falls on the ground, can not move and sees only sky, hears the sound of the battlefield around him but he is helpless and can't do anything instead of 3rd person view which we have now which shows you enemy who had killed you and let you tell your squad on chat/VOIP where he is exatcly

Another thing is that incapitated soldier is NOT a dead soldiers - actually it doesn't make a difference but it opens the way to improving medic class somehow in the future maybe?

Vote and discuss!  ;)
« Last Edit: 22-07-2011, 15:07:26 by jan_kurator »

Offline Flippy Warbear

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6.921
  • Adequately docile
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #1 on: 22-07-2011, 15:07:50 »
Yeah sometimes it just gets too hectic for me that I intentionally just dont spawn for a while to get myself into battle-element again. So a longer timeout would be for my taste personally.

Offline Slayer

  • Freeze Veteran
  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 4.125
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #2 on: 22-07-2011, 15:07:13 »
Nah, leave it as is. Black screen, OK, I don't need a deathcam. But not longer times down, I want action!

Btw: your options are not the same anymore after you have voted  ???

Offline jan_kurator

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 2.546
  • Magnificent Mustard
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #3 on: 22-07-2011, 15:07:51 »
Sorry for editing my poll and post, but I post it accidentally to fast and it needed a little corection!!!!
« Last Edit: 22-07-2011, 15:07:44 by jan_kurator »

Offline GooGeL

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 552
  • Shedmaster
    • View Profile
    • WOLFgaming.net
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #4 on: 22-07-2011, 15:07:42 »
I joined up a server to play the game, not watch it.

Offline LuckyOne

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2.722
  • Purple Heart Collector
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #5 on: 22-07-2011, 15:07:22 »
Personally as much as I want slower gameplay I wouldn't go this way... Instead I would go the other way of simulating real life situation. Right now we have people popping out of thin air next to their squadleaders...

I would remove SL spawn and make SL able to put rally points (NOT near the flags though). They could be repositioned after a specific amount of time. I would also remove flag spawns, that way forcing people to join squads. Leave only mainbase spawns.

And another, quite impossible option, make spawn times different for different spawns to simulate the time it takes to bring reinforcements... So for example you could choose to spawn in the mainbase instantly and then drive to your objective or spawn on a SL placed spawn point after let's say 20 seconds.
This sentence is intentionally left unfinished...

Offline hitm4k3r

  • Developer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1.123
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #6 on: 22-07-2011, 15:07:04 »
The idea with increasing the incapacitaion time is good (see the battle raging around you, till you die), since it adds some immersion. But on the other hand I would decrease the spawn time to maybe 5 sec. or so, because I don't want to wait too long to respawn. I want to play a game and not watching TV. And in fact, I don't think, that increasing the spawntime would solve the problem of ramboing.

Offline GooGeL

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 552
  • Shedmaster
    • View Profile
    • WOLFgaming.net
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #7 on: 22-07-2011, 16:07:17 »
The idea with increasing the incapacitaion time is good (see the battle raging around you, till you die), since it adds some immersion. But on the other hand I would decrease the spawn time to maybe 5 sec. or so, because I don't want to wait too long to respawn. I want to play a game and not watching TV. And in fact, I don't think, that increasing the spawntime would solve the problem of ramboing.
And you do realise if you let people lay dead on the ground who can still see what's going on... can also feed the whole team with intel or information about the other team. Where they are, where they are going, what they are up to.
Suicidal scouts :i

Offline jan_kurator

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 2.546
  • Magnificent Mustard
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #8 on: 22-07-2011, 16:07:44 »
Have you ever played vBF2? When you are "criticaly wounded" your camera is turned straight up and you can only see the sky - that's what I'm talking about. The only enemy you could spot in this way is a guys who would stand on you... You can hear what's going on around you but sounds are toned down and you also hear your heartbeat. Incapacitation camera is rather bad idea to use it to spot enemy movement... ;)

Offline hitm4k3r

  • Developer
  • ******
  • Posts: 1.123
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #9 on: 22-07-2011, 16:07:33 »
I think you got me both wrong.  :-\
I am more for this looking in the sky death cam. Not that you can look around or something else, but hearing the battle and heartbeat going slower or what ever. And recently you can see from the external view, where you died. So at the temporary status you are also possible to give intel to your comrades. And I played v.BF2, but not too long, since there is a great mod called Forotten Hope 2 ;D

Offline Eat Uranium

  • Tea Drinker
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 4.569
  • Today's news will contain [REDACTED]
    • View Profile
    • FH2 Music
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #10 on: 22-07-2011, 16:07:12 »
At the most I could support increasing the spawn time to 20 seconds (min 10 max 30 with the waves).  I don't think raising the incapacitation above 1 second is a good idea, since you do not always get incapacitated (e.g. die in a vehicle).

Offline jan_kurator

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 2.546
  • Magnificent Mustard
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #11 on: 22-07-2011, 17:07:44 »
Well, yes. Dying in vehicles is a different story. Increasing incapacitation time would affect only infantry combat and that's a main point of my suggestion. Slowing a gameplay according to vehicles is possibly by increase their spawntime, but I wanted to discuss this one aspect for now. If this one get players appreciation, topic could be spreaded to another direction. For now I can see that most of you want to keep it just as it is now (what is also good of course) ;)

...And recently you can see from the external view, where you died. So at the temporary status you are also possible to give intel to your comrades...
I thought that adding incapacitation time would replace actual 3rd person external view to prevent giving that intel to your comrades. What about adding black screen or something when you already dead (after being incapacitated) and waiting for respawn?

EDIT:

and btw, do not stick exactly to those numbers I gave in the poll - it's more about general suggestion, not a detailed concept, because even after adding such solution it would need testing to balanced it in game!  :P
« Last Edit: 22-07-2011, 17:07:11 by jan_kurator »

Offline Karl Hungus

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
    • View Profile
    • Forgotten Company
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #12 on: 22-07-2011, 18:07:59 »
I, for one, am thrilled to see that other players / members of the dev team of FH2 feel that the current gameplay of FH is too fast. IMHO, the changes to the game / playerbase mindset in version 2.2 made the mod's gameplay too fast and no longer enjoyable for me. I have downloaded each patch as they were released and believe that the changes in 2.4 have started to slow the gameplay back down.

As to length of spawntime, I prefer a system that penalizes the player who rushes headlong with no regard for his virtual life and rewards the cautious, tactical player who is looking for more from a game than just a reaction time tester. A system such as this would add respawn time to players who die a lot or TK and subtract respawn time from players who engage in teamwork oriented tasks (capping flags, defending flags, spotting, repairing, etc.). There would of course be minimum and maximum respawn times.

Offline Smiles

  • FH-Betatester
  • ***
  • Posts: 2.088
  • Boooo Auto-Spot! Booo
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #13 on: 22-07-2011, 18:07:50 »
Where is the decrease option? I sometimes get fustrated for having to wait 15 seconds and having to walk all the way back to the front. It doesnt have to be COD, but increasing? Hellllllllll no.
I'm taking my own freedom
puttin' it in my song
singing loud and strong
proving all day long
I'm takin' my freedom
puttin' it in my stroll
I'll be hop-steppin' y'all
lettin' the joy unfold

Offline General_Henry

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1.460
    • View Profile
Re: Increase the incapacitation time and lower gameplay speed!
« Reply #14 on: 22-07-2011, 18:07:35 »
fast gameplay is not decided by spawn time, instead game mechanics and map designs. Hope this makes sense. I prefer to walk an extra of 15 seconds instead of spawning 15 seconds later. Of course this would require a clever placement of spawn-points.

I do support using the incapacitate camera as death camera. I don't want my foes to know where I am hiding, or to hear gunfire after death. You could gather a hell lot of information about the battlefield from the current death camera. Like where the enemies are from sound of gunfire/tank engines, or just see their movement visually. A black screen would be too crazy for my like, I'd like to be able to see something even if it is very very unclear.

Of course, to kill the information gathering (which is unfair, it simply let a player to plan what to do after respawn while your living opponent don't have the luxury, the time, of doing so) during death would require to disable the minimap icons (use the wounded version of minimap) until you could respawn again. But this would be too drastic in my opinion because it makes dying really boring.

The current system is like this, don't start killing people until you get into the flag radius - because your enemy would respawn and grenade you as they know where you are!
« Last Edit: 23-07-2011, 03:07:17 by General_Henry »