Questions about tanks

[CHRISTIEFRONTDRIVE]

Thanks for the answer! New question: what was the best 'added' armor (i think the term is applique?) you could use on your tank in WW2? I know sandbags and extra tracks were used a lot but how effective were they really? What were some really effective ways of bulking up your tank without adding too much stress to the engine, transmission, etc? Could you theoretically cut perfectly good armor from a knocked out tank, and weld it to your own?

[THeTA0123]

they WHERE effective against early faustpatrones. Especialy sandbags could negate the effect of the faustpatrone

But any panzerfaust after then just went straight trough any applique armor like sandbags and tracks

Could you theoretically cut perfectly good armor from a knocked out tank, and weld it to your own?

Yes

Meet the super pershing. This beast took the gun mantlet of a Panther tank and placed it over its own gun mantlet. Shards of armor where also placed on the turret. Instead of 114mm protection, it became 214mm protection.

The hull armour also recieved a slab of panther armor thus being 104+80mm thick wich is 180mm. The armour was extremely thick at the "Tip" of the 2 plates.

so yes, perfectly possible

[SiCaRiO]

POOR TRANSMITION/ENGINE

[Kelmola]

In U.S. tests using captured equipment and real tanks, Panzerfaust (all versions) simply blew away the sandbags and the like. After this, Patton specifically forbade all troops serving under him to take any such measures.

[CHRISTIEFRONTDRIVE]

Dat Pershing .

Were there any risks to using such armor? Could it be shattered or knocked off easily if the welding wasn't up to scratch?

[VonMudra]

Course.  And metal track armour COULD help against enemy tank fire, but it would only help once, after which it would have been blown off.

Also, the Super Pershing, IIRC, deflected a, supposedly, Tiger's round, before knocking the tiger out.  Of course, considering that most german tanks got labeled "tigers", it might not have been one.

[Tankbuster]

... most german tanks got labeled "tigers", ...

Whuh?


Also, why wasn't the Churchill used in the Pacific Theater?

[Slayer]

... most german tanks got labeled "tigers", ...

Whuh?

Due to lack of knowledge about German tanks, most American (or all allied?) soldiers called all German tanks "Panzer" or "Tiger", just like they called all AT guns "88s".

[THeTA0123]

the amount of german honour preservation is to damn high!

[Butcher]

Nope, try to see the difference between a Panzer IV H/J and a Tiger beyond 500 metres. The H and J as we all know had sideskirts on the tower as well as the hull. Thus the whole vehicle looked "brawnier" or "thicker" much alike as the Tiger. Both tanks had the edgy, unsloped design. In the heat of battle those tanks got confused alot. You can see that for example at the battle of Kursk where Russians claimed to have destroyed more Tigers than there were ever produced -might be soviet propaganda as well- but the boxy desgin of the Mark IV and VI might play a role in that also.

Also there were green troops and even experienced troops didn´t see enemy tanks every day (on google/the internet) like we do. Even with tank identification lessons in basic training it might be hard to differ between a Panzer IV and a Tiger, especially on far distance.

Tigers were heavy tanks and had a reputation. Imagine how much cooler it sounds that you have knocked out a Tiger than a Panzer IV. Crews might have exaggerated a bit to impress. - We all know such a behaviour when talking to friends. 

the amount of german honour preservation is to damn high!

Get over it.


Now I have a question: Was it common to fire MGs at tanks to distract/annoy the crew? I heard every now and then that the noise in the tank when getting hit by bullets is incredibly loud. Was it effective at all or considered a waste of ammunition?

[THeTA0123]

Nope. Was a common practise. Especialy the high ROF of the BESA and MG34. The sound of these impacting on armour was quite loud...And you know that that enemy tank has sighted you. it raises stress levels, it raises the tought of being shot.

[siben]

Could also take out your optics and make you blind in the tank.

[Slayer]

Also there were green troops and even experienced troops didn´t see enemy tanks every day (on google/the internet) like we do. Even with tank identification lessons in basic training it might be hard to differ between a Panzer IV and a Tiger, especially on far distance.

This is what I call lack of knowledge, so actually we agree

[Mud Buddha]

Fucking POGs man!
Persons Other than Grunts. Every frontline soldier seems to hate them.

Which still seems the most silly thing you can do as a soldier, hate on the guys that make it possible for you to do your job and basically keep you alive. :-)

[MvB_1988]

...ordered them to concentrate automatic fire on the tracks of the advancing T-34s. Nobody was optimistic as to the likely outcome, but there remained little else they could do. ... They held their fire until the tanks had approached to within 200m. A burst of fire smashed the track of the leading T-34, which began to turn helplessly around on the same spot. Guns were then ordered to concentrate fire on the turrent. Even before the first magazine emptied, the turrent lid flipped open and a white flag appeared. The Russian crew clambored out and were taken prisoner. Meanwhile the cone of 20mm fire was switched to the left and another T-34 similiarly disabled.
Instead of surrendering, the crew of this vehicle chose to fight with small arms as they emerged. They were cut to pieces by multiple impacts of 20mm cannon explosions which sparked and spluttered around the hull. Other tanks met the same fate. Crews were scythed down at any sign of resistance. The rest of the T-34s turned back. It was inconcievable ...that their insignificant calibre cannon could have triumphed against tanks considered the heaviest of their type.
...They moved forward curiously to examine the results of their handiwork and discovered that, apart from cut caterpillar treads and damage to drive and sprocket wheels, there was nothing to explain the abrupt abandonment of the tanks. 'not until the prisoners were questioned did the riddle become clear'.... The answer lay in the resonant din produced by multiple 20mm strikes on cast steel turrents, which had the effect of transforming them into 'huge bells'.
'Continuous explosions on the turrent had produced a hellish noise which had grown louder from explosion to explosion. The sound had swollen beyond the realms of tolerance and had virtually driven the crews insane.'
... claimed his battery had disabled 32 T-34s tanks before the end of the year [1941], employing similiar tactics.


taken from "A War Without Garlands, operation Barbarossa 1941/42" by Robert Kershaw