*MASSIVE SPOILERS* The Force Awakens - Discussion

[Zoologic]

It requires no training to be able to talk to the Force ghosts that appear to you, otherwise Yoda wouldn't have had his little chat with Qui-Gon at all (sadly, this was cut from the movie). To be able to appear as a Force ghost (whether as a voice or a spectral being) does require a lot of training (or being a physical incarnation of the Force, as it was with Anakin).

Anakin is an arsehole, even after redeeming himself. He should have appeared as Force Ghost before Ben Solo turned to dark side and worshiping the shit out of his dead past. "Look at me horseface! You serve lamer villainy boss, with cheesier name. Forget about my breathing apparatus!"

[Matthew_Baker]

Holy crap there were people that disliked this movie?

Life must be hard being so pessimistic and having ridiculously high expectations for everything.

Movie was awesome. X-Wings flying low over the water/ 'nuff said. JJ Abrams dropped the mic.

Just be glad you didn't get 2 hours of CNN coverage over the politics going to battle against the Order. (aka the prequels)

[Kelmola]

Holy crap there were people that disliked this movie?

Life must be hard being so pessimistic and having ridiculously high expectations for everything.

Movie was awesome. X-Wings flying low over the water/ 'nuff said. JJ Abrams dropped the mic.

Just be glad you didn't get 2 hours of CNN coverage over the politics going to battle against the Order. (aka the prequels)

TFA had the same amount of exposition than the Original Trilogy had, and even without any supplemental materials or extended political debate it is made pretty clear what the situation is: First Order have so far been a fringe group operating in the periphery of the galaxy that no-one really takes seriously until they do a combined 9/11 and Pearl Harbor, and the Republic has been content to wage a half-hearted effort of a proxy war through the Resistance. What I missed on the first viewing was that they even mention in the Resistance briefing that the Hosnian system was destroyed, not Coruscant. Some explanation could perhaps have been included why the entirety of the Republic fleet was kept in low orbit above the capital, but at least they show ships in the brief shot and mention it afterwards.

---

The prequels had painstaking attention to detail in the gorgeous visuals, Williams was still in top form on the soundtrack, they had innovative ideas and a bold mix of different genres. All destroyed by horrible pacing, writing, and direction (and over-reliance on CGI). TFA plays it safe and is a straight-up action-adventure, but succeeds in everything where the prequels failed, and even though it should on paper feel all-too-familiar and Williams (and/or his apprentices) are phoning it in, it FEELS just like the Original Trilogy does. And feeling is all that matters.

I should really see it the third and fourth and fifth time, because I liked it even more on the second viewing (so it's becoming 5/5 now). Also, on second viewing I could pay attention to all the little details because I was not too overcome with emotion.

[Captain Pyjama Shark]

I should really see it the third and fourth and fifth time, because I liked it even more on the second viewing (so it's becoming 5/5 now). Also, on second viewing I could pay attention to all the little details because I was not too overcome with emotion.

Be sure not to miss all the glib pandering injokes about the earlier films either!

[Zoologic]

Actually the movie is very fine for me, 4/5. After dissapointing holiday season releases, SW7 is a great relief.

BBC ruins it for me. They cover what the critics say about SW7:TFA and it was all applause. I had high expectations, and yet not dissapointed at all, considering the awfulness of the prequels. The critics (British particularly) are also hyping the last James Bond movie up. Spectre dissapoints me greatly, 3/5... no British bias. Then, there is the ending of The Hunger Games. The young adult genre is stale. But this one actually is pretty fine, 3.5/5.

I watched Episode II last night and it was cheesy, all around cheesy, it reeks of cheesiness in every dialogue, why does their facial expression doesn't match their dialogue and emotion? Also, Obi-wan supposed to be a wise master, yet he is inconsistent wise-cracking old kook in the prequels. He shown enough pestering to his Padawan, now in Episode II, it is where he started the whole "I hate it when he does that!" rhetorics. Anakin jumps out of the speeder to caught the assassin. He quips again. Yet, earlier, he smashes through Padme's apartment window to dangle on the assassin's droid. All in all, rubbish. Perhaps the worst Star Wars movie ever.

[PanzerKnacker]

Analyzing prequel soundtracks to identify Snoke

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd_8-NCN5CU

[Kelmola]

Be sure not to miss all the glib pandering injokes about the earlier films either!

Yo, Imma let you finish, but A New Hope was the glibbest facsimile of them all:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4g8r0LhpMzk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNdb03Hw18M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OZq-tlJTrU

and to sum it up:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx15aXjcDZg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--BVUTOrYP8

[Captain Pyjama Shark]

Be sure not to miss all the glib pandering injokes about the earlier films either!

Yo, Imma let you finish, but A New Hope was the glibbest facsimile of them all:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4g8r0LhpMzk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNdb03Hw18M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OZq-tlJTrU

and to sum it up:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx15aXjcDZg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--BVUTOrYP8

http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/cover_story/2015/12/star_wars_is_a_pastiche_how_george_lucas_combined_flash_gordon_westerns.html?wpsrc=sh_all_tab_em_bot

It's no secret that Lucas put together lots of different elements into one big pastiche.  The thing is that he had multiple, original inspirations.  J.J. Abrams only had one: a New Hope.

[Erwin]

Episode I-II-III is all about one liners and meaningless staring into oblivion. People walks, talks, sits, talks a few minutes of action and stupid Haydon't actagains stupid acting. Even Natalie Portman plays like "Oh what the hell I'm doing here?"

And oh, go and watch Honest Trailers about those 3.

[Seth_Soldier]

at least the CGI was awesome for the time !

E7 is disappointed because it had potentials but failed,
all these useless/annoying clin d'oeil,
no badass (why it wasn't Phasma who used the anti riot stick ? or even why she simply lower the shields without her setting a trick or something, the emo kid).
nuremberg style rally failed to reach the intensity of a killzone visari speech or the orginal nuremberg rally
explaining all the plot/relations too soon
a other deathstar to blow via its exhaust port ?
I like the new design of the trooper, but in the film it feels that their helmet bounce on their head.

I guess i'm too old for that ...

[Kelmola]

The thing is that he had multiple, original inspirations.  J.J. Abrams only had one: a New Hope.

I do not recall that the McGuffin of any of the previous Star Wars films was finding the missing Jedi Master - Luke navigates to Dagobah quite easily when told to. Also, where was the rescue mission that the Rebels mounted to save our heroes? Where was the Alien-esque hide-and-seek against man-eating monsters in the corridors of a mostly empty cargoship? Don't remember the victory in ANH being as hollow, after all, the Rebel military was hardly affected by the loss of one peaceful planet which was apparently not in very open rebellion else it would have been invaded already (though Leia would not obviously have admitted even if Alderaan had had significant military capabilities), don't remember the Rebel fleet being knocked out ever either.

The characters I also don't recall. Don't remember that any of the protagonists was an orphan who had forgotten about her parents, yet wanted to return home even after getting a taste of the adventure. Or that any of the protagonists was a defecting stormtrooper on the run. Or that the ace pilot was actually a serious professional whose skills actually matched his boasting. Or that estranged parents decide to renconcile their disagreement and try once more turning back their wayward son, all in vain. I don't even remember that any of the bad guys had shown any hesitation either when trying to embrace the darkness.

[Captain Pyjama Shark]

The thing is that he had multiple, original inspirations.  J.J. Abrams only had one: a New Hope.

I do not recall that the McGuffin of any of the previous Star Wars films was finding the missing Jedi Master - Luke navigates to Dagobah quite easily when told to. Also, where was the rescue mission that the Rebels mounted to save our heroes? Where was the Alien-esque hide-and-seek against man-eating monsters in the corridors of a mostly empty cargoship? Don't remember the victory in ANH being as hollow, after all, the Rebel military was hardly affected by the loss of one peaceful planet which was apparently not in very open rebellion else it would have been invaded already (though Leia would not obviously have admitted even if Alderaan had had significant military capabilities), don't remember the Rebel fleet being knocked out ever either.

The characters I also don't recall. Don't remember that any of the protagonists was an orphan who had forgotten about her parents, yet wanted to return home even after getting a taste of the adventure. Or that any of the protagonists was a defecting stormtrooper on the run. Or that the ace pilot was actually a serious professional whose skills actually matched his boasting. Or that estranged parents decide to renconcile their disagreement and try once more turning back their wayward son, all in vain. I don't even remember that any of the bad guys had shown any hesitation either when trying to embrace the darkness.

Are you kidding?

Poe = Cross between Han and Luke/Wedge
Rey = Cross between Leia and Luke
Finn = Cross between Luke
Kylo Rylie = Cross between Luke and Vader (Indeed, the film is pretty clearly about imitations.  Rylo Kylie is imitating Darth Vader, the First Order is imitating the Empire.  Some might find this a clever motif, I think it's a cute gimmick at best.)

For the rest, I'll quote the AV Club Review: "The Force Awakens borrows so much from the 1977 original—environments, relationship dynamics, action scenes, even a basic plot structure—that it often resembles a remake as much as a straight sequel."

The film is an alright film, as one would suspect any throwback remake of a Star Wars film would be.  I'm sure it will create a legion of new fans.  The question is: why was this necessary?  A New Hope is already an excellent film that should win over fans, why make a new, slightly inferior clone?

[Zoologic]

ANH is great for its time, but it will be utterly cheesy in today's standards. The whole space-action scenes uses old-timey "whole battlefield" view, sometimes with wrong perspective due to inconsistent prop scaling. Things were randomly shot, and generally just explodes. "Goof" section in IMDB.com will be full of unnecessary nitpickings if ANH was released instead.

The last update for ANH makes it even cheesier and lose its context. In short, the movie is hopelessly inadequate to compete in modern times with other Disney's giant frachise like Marvel and the upcoming DC's. Let alone kicking silver screen Star Trek aside, despite their meager success.

TFA has a lot of letdowns for sure, I still cannot come to terms with the loss of the whole EU materials (especially the nice ones) for a villain like Ben Solo. Are Desann (which is also a student of Luke and destroys the Jedi Academy) and Marka Ragnos not good enough compared to Kaylo Ren?

[Captain Pyjama Shark]

ANH is great for its time, but it will be utterly cheesy in today's standards. The whole space-action scenes uses old-timey "whole battlefield" view, sometimes with wrong perspective due to inconsistent prop scaling. Things were randomly shot, and generally just explodes. "Goof" section in IMDB.com will be full of unnecessary nitpickings if ANH was released instead.

I will hold that the Battle of Yavin is a far better directed and more suspenseful action sequence than the "Battle of Starkiller Base".  In fact, the three battles in the original Star Wars trilogy are probably my favourite action sequences to this day. 

[Zoologic]

Battle of Yavin scene is just like D-Day battle scenes: realistic, procedural, and representing the time of their creation. I also have strong likings for such classic war movies, they are intense in a grand scale. Modern battle scenes are just too focused on single localised overly-dramatised actions.

But here is the main problem in 2015: for a sci-fi, they are quite dated and lacks of the technological refinements that we have today. Teenies, millenials spoiled by their "smartphone" technologies would most likely laughed at: magnetically altered radio voices, monochromatic time-delayed displays (US Navy already has a clear-glass display like the one shown in Yavin rebel base during Vietnam war), dangling equipment cables inside a sophisticated space fighters cockpit, constant-needing of calibration targetting scope, separate targetting computer scope with twitchy mechanism (South Africa already have integrated Helmet Mounted Sight back in 1970s). The shaky cockpit camera shot and their combat very much represents World War 2 era fights. The 1974 General Dynamics F-16 already have "relaxed stability" flight controls by the help of FBW computers.

Compared to the "clean and modern, real space-age" looks of excessive screen glares of Star Trek? Yes, not for 2015 release. TFA instead, wraps the lack of militaristic senses with close action chasing camera view, exagerrated sound effects, and accentuated screen effects. It is just more relevant to this new generation.