A few annoyances in my favorite game.

[10-32]

First is something I would like a community opinion of. There are certain maps which do not have safe zones, yet they also have artillery placed close to the spawn.
Is engaging this artillery the same as baserape? I mean, many of these people do little more than sit on mortars and artillery pieces for the whole game while they rack up the kills. Why should they be invulnerable under rules protecting those who actually PLAY the game?
For example, if I take a sniper rifle and I engage the artillery from a few hundred yards outside the spawn, how can that be considered spawn camping?

Next is the concept of tanks being killed. Why does the whole tank explode in a fireball after one hit? I think more often than not, knocked out tanks had surviors, let alone killing anyone in the immediate area on a single hit. I cant tell you how frustrating it is to be in a tank, get hit and reduced to almost no operability, bailing out and getting a few feet away and dying just because the tank got hit again. Its just not realistic.

The last issue I feel needs to be addressed is the Americans in this game. Out of 23 standard maps, there are only 3 representing the Americans. In addition to this, they are dark and tedious maps. For example, the British fight in clear conditions with complete visibility and open areas such as Totalize and Goodwood, whereas the Americans can barely distingish uniforms in the dark and foggy conditions of Luttich and PHL.

[Ts4EVER]

1. This is server-side. I think on hslan you wouldn't get into trouble for killing artillerists. However, I wouldn't consider playing artillery as "not playing the game". It is a very important and effective role in the game. The team without proper artillery loses.

2. First of all, tanks can not be "damaged" or "immobilised" in FH2. Other than that, the explosive radius never struck me as particularly big. Also, I think there are two possibilities: The tank blows up in a fireball or it just turns into a wreck without exploding. i don't know if there is a difference other than the missing graphic effect though.

3. That is because the Americans were only added in the last patch, whereas most of the other maps came in 2.0 - 2.15. Which maps are made is up to the mappers, so I guess most mappers were not particularly interested in the Americans and those who were preferred to make darker maps. Point du Hoc is darker for a reason though, as it mirrors the actual weather of June the 6th.

edit: also, you wrote "PHL". I don't think that is a good example for a dark map, it strikes me as quite light, perhaps early evening conditions.

[Thorondor123]

3. And the fact that there were other nations fighting in the was. Not only the GI Joe.

[Flippy Warbear]

Saying that artillery just sits down and racks up kills is also dependable if the artillerist receives any targets from spotters. No spotters, no kills to be racked either. And that can sometimes mean that the team is one or even more guys down from fighting force since they just spend their time sitting at the artillery pieces waiting to perhaps receive at least some sort of a target, but all you get is some half-assed spotter wannabe giving empty field as target.

[THeTA0123]

a team with artillery on a assault map is a deciesive factor


Take tobruk. If that LEFH18 issent used, your chances of victory are cut in halve

Of Normandy, their are 7 maps. 3 American 3 British and 2 Canadian. Pretty good i'de say

Dont worry, i'm sure their will be many more American maps soon


after all...I WANT MAH HELLCAT

[djinn]

I get you, 10-32, I really do... Especially the last bit...

The yanks' map ARE all dark... darker than the Brits at least.. Not a bad thing... Its just the time of the particualr map and the coincidence that the devs decided to make those maps for the American side

And yes, they were late in the war mod - So they don't have all their assets, no air, no mobile AA, no mobile artillery etc... But in time, that will change - I have a feeling the next update will be favorable for the yanks since well, that theater has alot more known American battles than Canadians or British... Most games have Britain ending at Caen, and the Americans going all the way to the Rhine... or even fuirther

And its not unfair that there are only 3.. there are more American in the 2.2 maps than anyone else - 3 American, 2 British, 2 Canadian... And NA had mostly British battles... Wait long enough and you'd have FH2 completely fair for all sides... Besides, perhaps the Canucks.. your finest hour was Dieppe, see what you did with that :-P (jk)

If anything at all, it might be heavy Ruski, heavy Yank if and when we cover the Eastern front and the Pacific, cuz with the maps the Yanks already have, plus ALL those pacific maps, we wont be lacking in American propaganda contribution to the war


About the tanks, simplest response... Yes, it sucks balls... but that's BF2 for you - Even more an arcade system that BF42.. but we try, no? I'm sure the devs, as ingenious as they are will find a way to make it a tad more interesting for tankers... But don't expect engine cease or specific damage

Oh, I like to engage arty when its killing my squad - And give my side a fighting chance... Did that quite a bit in Nordwind SP for FH1 - Considered it a badge of honour when I was able to crawl up to the buff and take a snipe at those nebelwerfer gunners or better yet, actually wait long enough for all tanks to go, dash in, kill a few defenders and blow up both guns with sachel charges.. made defending the front a tad easier - But I hear that sorta thing is frowned upon in some circles... pff! - *Looking snooty* cultural differences (LOL)

[Mazz]

1. If you can kill the gunner without camping the base and/or killing spawners I don't see how that is a real problem. They shouldn't be invincible cause their position puts them in a "safe zone", although I guess this is a server side decision. Maybe one day with mobile artillery we will start seeing more counter-battery.

2. The BF2 engine, not much you can do there. If a system of coding ever becomes available to make it more complex that'd be awesome, but I don't want to see a arcadish system where it simply takes more rounds. If you've ever read anything about a Panther or Tiger shell hitting a Sherman, you'd know that the effects that occur inside the tank aren't exactly pleasant. This is even more apparent once we get to the larger guns of the Soviets and what a 122mm shell that doesn't even penetrate can still do to the crew inside.

3. Luttich's environment while dark and foggy I think provides some of the best ambush territory in the game at the moment. The problem is this territory better suits the PzG40 of the Puma and the Shreck then it does the Greyhound or Zook. Overall I love the map tho, just wish it was a little bigger and/or more accessible, and had another M10 or something to help with the 2 Panthers. My favorite map currently in a tie with Totalize though.

PdH and PHL are agreed dark and make uniform distinguishment difficult at times, maybe its my settings but PHL is a real bitch at times when the fighting is stationary and ranged. PdH has its moments of awesomeness though. I'm not a big infantry guy so my opinion of these 2 is biased towards dislike.

Hopefully in the future we get another map like Sector 318, but with Hellcats and more places to hide. Big tank maps I think in general are real crowd pleasers, as long as they're is a place for infantry and aircraft. You also have to realize that the American armor generally got decimated in the early stages of Normandy in the bocage, and therefore giving them tank maps at this point puts them at a general disadvantage. Ardennes should be fun.

[HappyFunBall]

I mean, many of these people do little more than sit on mortars and artillery pieces for the whole game while they rack up the kills. Why should they be invulnerable under rules protecting those who actually PLAY the game?

What servers does this happen on, and when can I join them?

As Flippy said, playing artillery means a LOT of just waiting for spots. It also runs, by far, the highest risk of TK'ing of any role in the game. If you play artillery it is because you want to support your team it is NOT a good way to run up your score. Quite the opposite really, playing artillery means accepting a very low score in the round.

If you doubt this, I can prove it with ease. Spend an entire round on artillery, then spend an entire round on the same map doing whatever else you are best at (tanker, pilot, rambo, whatever). I guarantee you, your score as artillery will be much lower.

Don't want to do that, ok. Next time you are playing take a look at the score of an artillery player at the end of every round. None will rise much higher than mid-range among their teammates.

[Meadow]

The last issue I feel needs to be addressed is the Americans in this game. Out of 23 standard maps, there are only 3 representing the Americans. In addition to this, they are dark and tedious maps. For example, the British fight in clear conditions with complete visibility and open areas such as Totalize and Goodwood, whereas the Americans can barely distingish uniforms in the dark and foggy conditions of Luttich and PHL.

Forgive me, but I can't really see your point here. Calling the low number of maps featuring the US Army something that 'needs to be addressed' is arrogant to say the least, and if we're talking about representing countries, I feel the African campaign has done well to present the British and Australian contributions, as well as to an extent the Italian side to the campaign. Normandy has only 7 maps, and given the smaller contribution made by the Americans in North Africa (the only really necessary map would be Kasserine Pass) only these 7 can be counted as potential 'American' maps. 3 out of 7 is not bad. The mod has done an excellent job presenting two sides of the Normandy campaign that the mainstream media of games has avoided in recent years - the British and Canadian side. The Americans have been 'overplayed' as it were. They'll get more maps, rest assured. But don't go acting like a lack of American maps is 'something that needs to be addressed' - it reeks of Ameri-centric jingoism.

[azreal]

Forgive me, but I can't really see your point here. Calling the low number of maps featuring the US Army something that 'needs to be addressed' is arrogant to say the least, and if we're talking about representing countries, I feel the African campaign has done well to present the British and Australian contributions, as well as to an extent the Italian side to the campaign. Normandy has only 7 maps, and given the smaller contribution made by the Americans in North Africa (the only really necessary map would be Kasserine Pass) only these 7 can be counted as potential 'American' maps. 3 out of 7 is not bad. The mod has done an excellent job presenting two sides of the Normandy campaign that the mainstream media of games has avoided in recent years - the British and Canadian side. The Americans have been 'overplayed' as it were. They'll get more maps, rest assured. But don't go acting like a lack of American maps is 'something that needs to be addressed' - it reeks of Ameri-centric jingoism.

Couldn't have put it better myself. Well said Meadow.

[hslan.totaler_humbug]

Hi, and welcome to the Forums

First is something I would like a community opinion of. There are certain maps which do not have safe zones, yet they also have artillery placed close to the spawn.
Is engaging this artillery the same as baserape? I mean, many of these people do little more than sit on mortars and artillery pieces for the whole game while they rack up the kills. Why should they be invulnerable under rules protecting those who actually PLAY the game?
For example, if I take a sniper rifle and I engage the artillery from a few hundred yards outside the spawn, how can that be considered spawn camping?

Next is the concept of tanks being killed. Why does the whole tank explode in a fireball after one hit? I think more often than not, knocked out tanks had surviors, let alone killing anyone in the immediate area on a single hit. I cant tell you how frustrating it is to be in a tank, get hit and reduced to almost no operability, bailing out and getting a few feet away and dying just because the tank got hit again. Its just not realistic.

The last issue I feel needs to be addressed is the Americans in this game. Out of 23 standard maps, there are only 3 representing the Americans. In addition to this, they are dark and tedious maps. For example, the British fight in clear conditions with complete visibility and open areas such as Totalize and Goodwood, whereas the Americans can barely distingish uniforms in the dark and foggy conditions of Luttich and PHL.

1. It really depends on the server. For example, on hslan no mainbaseattack (mainbases are bases which will never be capable) is allowed, exept for planes. That means the artillery guys are somewhat in a safe zone there, but if you are on a map with planes you can tell the pilot to shot the artillery. You have to see, if it´s on other servers different.

2. Didn´t thought about that much, but I can say, that destroying different parts of the tank is not possible, because the engine ujst features hitpoints, that means, that the tank will be dead, when the hitpoints drop to zero. And I think that at least a explosion of the tank is better than just having a wreck on the field.

3. Americans were added in the latest patch in September, before this the mod took place in North Africa between Germans/Italians and Brits/Aussies. And out of 7 new Maps 3 have the Americans. You allways have to remember, that FH2 has maps with historical background, so you just can´t add the Americans to Lebisey or Totalize. And which maps are produced allways depends on the moode of the mappers   .
But stay tuned, as I can say, that more maps are being produced yet for future realeses and some of them will feature the American Army.

[General Tso]

First of all, welcome to the community.  

You're not going to get far here blasting the mod for lack of American maps.  Given a community vote, there probably wouldn't be U.S. forces in the mod at all.  Well, maybe not...but this is truly a non-U.S. centric mod, unlike popular culture versions of WWII.  The U.S. maps will come soon enough.  

I saw the beta testers working Sunday on a map called Operation Cobra, which will certainly have U.S. forces in it.

The basecamping issue is nothing new, and the policy will vary from server to server.  If you get banned from a server, go plead your case on the clan or group's forums.  It would suck to booted from one of the handful of populated FH2 servers.

I personally hate admining servers.  Back when I had a clan that played FH1/DC, we had a server that had a mixed bag of vanilla BF1942, DC, FH1, EOD (remember those days, mixed mods ftw!) and we always had problems admining Coral Sea.  Deck jumpers bayoneting AA gunners and engineers often ruined gameplay and made admining a full time job.  I digress.

[Hresvelgr]

In addition to this, they are dark and tedious maps. For example, the British fight in clear conditions with complete visibility and open areas such as Totalize and Goodwood, whereas the Americans can barely distingish uniforms in the dark and foggy conditions of Luttich and PHL.

Sorry to come off as very rude, but I must say BULL! It isn't hard at all to distinguish uniforms. God, I'm so sick of teamkills on PHL just because people like you can't discern brown-orange camo shirts from bright olive-drab at 10m. They look nothing alike! I can't understand the confusion on this map. People like you make it out to be much harder than it actually is to tell allies from enemies.

[10-32]

Maybe my original post was poorly worded.

As far as artillery goes, I think someone who sits at a gun and risks very little should not be less vulnerable than someone who advances and captures objectives. I believe a team should need to defend their artillery or lose one of their most valuable assets, and artillery is a VERY valuable asset.

When I speak of the Americans in the maps, as of July 25th 1944, there was 812,000 American troops and only 640,000 commonwealth (Canadian, Free French, British etc). I just feel the Americans played a larger part in the fighting on the western front and as such should be better represented. That being said, I understand that the Americans are still in a semi-experimental stage and I will wait patiently until they are more fully integrated.

[djinn]

And its not unfair that there are only 3.. there are more American in the 2.2 maps than anyone else - 3 American, 2 British, 2 Canadian... And NA had mostly British battles... Wait long enough and you'd have FH2 completely fair for all sides... Besides, perhaps the Canucks.. your finest hour was Dieppe, see what you did with that :-P (jk)

If anything at all, it might be heavy Ruski, heavy Yank if and when we cover the Eastern front and the Pacific, cuz with the maps the Yanks already have, plus ALL those pacific maps, we wont be lacking in American propaganda contribution to the war